00:07 <@Loggers_VIII> @e?kas 00:07 Kas (V) | Lvl: 26 | Diff: 30 | Spd: 16 | Res: sleep poison drain | Confer: nothing | MR: 70 | Gen: unique | AC: -5 | Atk: 4d4 weapon physical, 4d4 weapon physical, 1d12 bite level drain | Align: -10 | flies, breathless, regen, poisonous, nopoly, stalker, silverhate, infravis 00:15 -!- ais523 has quit [Quit: quit] 00:17 [hdf-us] [nh370] vor (Mon Hum Fem Cha) entered Gehennom, on T:31586 00:37 -!- CAT_S has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:37 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 00:42 <@Loggers_VIII> @e?kathryn the enchantress 00:42 Kathryn the Enchantress (@) | Lvl: 100 | Diff: 104 | Spd: 9 | Res: fire cold sleep disintegrate shock poison acid petrification drain | Confer: nothing | MR: 100 | Gen: unique | AC: 0 | Atk: 10d10 weapon physical, 10d10 cast clerical, 10d10 cast spell | Align: 15 | omnivore, flies, regen, seeinvis, nopoly 00:43 <@Loggers_VIII> hm 00:48 [hdf-us] [xnh] DragonSidedD (Mon Hum Mal Cha) acquired the Mines' End luckstone, on T:5214 00:50 [hdf-eu] [nh370] Raisse (Wiz Orc Fem Cha) wished for "very uncursed thoroughly magic marker", got "a magic marker", on T:20122 00:52 [hdf-us] [nh370] arthur (Wiz Gno Mal Neu) consulted the Oracle, on T:8375 00:57 -!- leah2 has joined #hardfought 01:01 [hdf-us] [nh370] arthur (Wiz Gno Mal Neu), 6797 points, T:9259, killed by a chameleon imitating a mastodon 01:02 -!- Sgeo has joined #hardfought 01:03 [hdf-us] [nh370] vor (Mon Hum Fem Cha) made her first wish - "blessed fixed +2 gauntlets of power", got "a pair of old gloves", on T:33576 01:10 [hdf-us] [nh370] Prokythera (Tou Hum Fem Neu), 113 points, T:382, killed by a bear trap 01:11 [hdf-us] [xnh] DragonSidedD (Mon Hum Mal Cha) entered Sokoban, on T:7267 01:13 [hdf-us] [evil] Sioh (Val Cen Fem Neu), 1361 points, T:1856, killed by a gnome lord 01:15 [hdf-us] [evil] bouquet (Sam Gia Fem Law) had a long sword entrusted to her by Amaterasu Omikami, on T:33741 (5:20:48) 01:20 [hdf-eu] [nh370] nmlkj (Wiz Hum Mal Cha), 2406 points, T:2217, killed by a blue jelly 01:21 [hdf-au] [nh370] Grasshopper (Wiz Hum Fem Neu) attained the rank of Sorceress (level 18), on T:53014 01:23 [hdf-eu] [nh370] nmlkj (Wiz Hum Mal Cha), 143 points, T:718, killed by a large mimic 01:27 [hdf-us] [evil] Sioh (Val Cen Fem Neu) killed the Goblin King, on T:860 (0:14:25) 01:30 [hdf-au] [nh370] Grasshopper (Wiz Hum Fem Neu) entered Gehennom, on T:53216 01:34 [hdf-eu] [nh370] nmlkj (Wiz Hum Mal Cha), 886 points, T:2052, killed by a dwarf 01:34 -!- CAT_S has joined #hardfought 01:53 [hdf-au] [nh370] Grasshopper (Wiz Hum Fem Neu) killed Medusa, on T:54165 01:53 [hdf-eu] [nh370] nmlkj (Wiz Hum Mal Cha), 1841 points, T:3698, killed by a dwarf lord 01:56 [hdf-us] [evil] Sioh (Val Cen Fem Neu) stole 9663 zorkmids worth of merchandise from Sadelin's jewelers, on T:2446 (0:42:43) 02:01 <@fredriq> morning 02:02 <@fredriq> @Loggers_VIII because they interfere with item generation, and finding them as a spellcaster is just plain frustrating. There are better ways to honor someone rather than adding a useless item (mechanically) into the game 02:02 <@fredriq> that overrides other generation and just becomes a feelsbad thing 02:07 [hdf-us] [evil] Sioh (Val Cen Fem Neu), 4871 points, T:3257, petrified by a cockatrice 02:09 [hdf-us] [nh370] Prokythera (Mon Hum Fem Cha), 2100 points, T:3318, killed by a rothe, while praying 02:14 <@Loggers_VIII> Morning @fredriq 02:14 <@Loggers_VIII> Don’t they only generate in shops though? 02:15 <@Loggers_VIII> That’s like extremely extremely minor annoyance at most 02:16 <@Loggers_VIII> I go games without even seeing a novel all the time 02:17 So basically what you are saying, Loggers_VIII, is that finding a novel in a game would be.. novel for you, eh? :) 02:17 <@Loggers_VIII> Pffft 02:17 * docpi smiles brightly 02:17 <@Loggers_VIII> Well said :) 02:21 <@fredriq> that might be the case in 3.7 but I've seen them ouytside in 3.6 02:22 <@fredriq> and that only minimizes the problem, it doesn't solve it 02:22 I've almost never seen them outside in those cases 02:22 in fact I feel like I haven't at all 02:24 <@fredriq> @Loggers_VIII butt yeah I have a more exhaustive list of things I dislike in 3.6 on desktop. I don't remember half of it nowdays since I haven't played nethack in several years 02:24 <@fredriq> until now 02:24 <@fredriq> *but 02:26 <@fredriq> speed randomization and the way overkill Elbereth nerf (thankfully walked back), removal of trinsic-gain from P 02:27 <@fredriq> qRodney uest arti steal change 02:27 <@Loggers_VIII> P? 02:27 <@fredriq> puddings 02:27 NH370 reports: "Program in disorder! (Saving and reloading may fix this problem.)" 02:27 "Please report these messages to devteam@nethack.org." 02:27 <@Loggers_VIII> you can gain trinsics from pudding globs 02:28 "Alternatively, contact local support: Contact K2 or Tangles on Libera irc 02:28 channel #hardfought" 02:28 <@fredriq> no? unless that changed 02:28 "placing defunct monster onto map, mstate:2, on Dlvl:26?" 02:28 <@Loggers_VIII> I’ve gained shock res from them at least 02:28 <@fredriq> hmm ok, so that's another reverted change 02:28 <@fredriq> cool 02:28 Medusa level, my pet titan and water troll were busy killing electric eels for me 02:29 <@Loggers_VIII> It is only 7% chance for each intrinsic, so it may have been higher if that’s what you mean 02:29 <@fredriq> perhaps, but the important part is that you can get them 02:29 <@fredriq> the arbitrary removal of trinsic gain from them was just frustrating 02:29 <@Loggers_VIII> Yeah that sounds silly 02:30 <@Loggers_VIII> I also thought the big speed randomization changes were reversed, though it’s still random to an extent 02:30 <@Loggers_VIII> I never played much with earlier speed so I don’t have anything to say on it lol 02:30 oh shit, my pet titan (K2) has disappeared!! 02:31 I saved, reloaded, and pet titan is gone 02:31 <@Loggers_VIII> Aw wtf :c 02:31 <@Loggers_VIII> K2’s probably asleep right now 02:31 -!- mobileuser has joined #hardfought 02:32 <@fredriq> I always detested dcss speed randomization 02:32 <@Loggers_VIII> I think he’s like one hour ahead of me so it’s like 2:30 am for him 02:32 <@fredriq> I was not happy to see it come to NH 02:32 some error came up while he was snotting electric eels 02:32 <@Loggers_VIII> I never played much dcss 02:32 <@Loggers_VIII> I tried it and found it sort of brain dead 02:33 <@Loggers_VIII> but maybe I’ll give it another shot 02:33 <@fredriq> I don't really like dcss tbh 02:33 <@Loggers_VIII> From what I played it was like the filler gnomish mine levels but a whole game 02:33 <@fredriq> I play it sometimes for variety's sake, esp now that they added the Djinn race 02:33 <@Loggers_VIII> Kill stuff and keep walkin 02:33 <@fredriq> but I always preferred NH 02:34 <@Loggers_VIII> I can see why people like dcss. It’s a lot easier to pick up and play and the UI is nice 02:35 <@Loggers_VIII> Anyway, King Arthur killed me recently because he rolled a lucky turn I guess and got two moves on me, so I’m not the biggest fan of the speed rando 02:36 <@Loggers_VIII> But I think I like it more than always fixed speed? Most of the time it’s pretty much identical anyway. But again I’m not the biggest expert on how it was before 02:36 <@fredriq> I disagree on the latter 02:37 <@fredriq> I much prefer NH curses interface. DCSS makes really poor use of screen real estate 02:37 <@Loggers_VIII> Yeah curses is the goat 02:37 <@fredriq> I was replying to this (irc: to the "I can see why people ..." message) 02:38 <@Loggers_VIII> But you gotta like set it up in a confit file and shit. Dcss you get into it right away and it looks ok 02:38 <@Loggers_VIII> *config 02:38 <@fredriq> I implemented inventory sidebar around 2018 or so 02:38 <@fredriq> it made curses like 10 times more useful IMO 02:38 <@Loggers_VIII> For new players config files are confusing af heh 02:38 <@fredriq> that + the multiline message log 02:38 <@Loggers_VIII> What is inventory sidebar 02:38 <@fredriq> are the 2 best things about curses 02:38 <@fredriq> IMO 02:38 <@Loggers_VIII> Just the permanent inventory on the side? 02:39 <@fredriq> yes, that 02:39 <@fredriq> perm_invent 02:39 <@Loggers_VIII> I mean those two things are the only reason to use curses imo 02:39 <@fredriq> hah 02:39 <@fredriq> it is actually a sem-recent addition 02:39 <@fredriq> 2018ish as mentioned above 02:39 <@Loggers_VIII> That’s interesting. I sort of though it’d be older 02:40 <@Loggers_VIII> *thought dammit 02:40 <@fredriq> before then, you still had multiline msglog of course 02:40 <@fredriq> but that was pretty much the only benefit 02:40 <@fredriq> I also like that in 3.4.3-based variants, I can use the NH4 status bar in curses 02:40 <@fredriq> Which I also added 😛 02:40 <@Loggers_VIII> pff 02:41 <@fredriq> I overhauled curses alongside Tangles back then 02:41 <@fredriq> fixing weird code, adding features etc 02:41 <@fredriq> Tangles also added some rendering fixes, before then curses was somewhat laggy 02:41 <@fredriq> especially on poor connections 02:44 <@fredriq> it frustrated me a bit that DT decided to outright kill my NH4-like status bar code in the 3.6.x port 02:44 <@fredriq> so I can't use it there 02:45 <@Loggers_VIII> aw :( 02:46 yes, we in the devteam routinely take everyone's favorite pieces of code and chop the heads off 02:47 <@Loggers_VIII> snicker snack! 02:47 it's a conscious decision we do every time 02:47 just to be maximum evil 02:47 <@fredriq> paxed: I asked about it when it was commented out (it relied on statusupdate or whatever thepatch was called), and DT was clear that they had no interest in an updated version for statushilites 02:48 <@fredriq> I can't take that as any other way than a rejection... 02:48 <@fredriq> Also, multiple of my PRs on github was utterly ignored, but that seems to have been a general issue, not just forme:P 02:49 <@fredriq> and then there was the quest arti change, which I suspect might be part of what made tungtn leave the community alltogether 02:50 <@fredriq> He and I independently suggested making Rodney not steal your quest arti, but maybe other roles, to make each role more distinct. DT did the exact opposite 02:50 <@Loggers_VIII> great hook now give me the thesis 02:50 <@fredriq> Later on, I had a similar experience with slime: I suggested that genociding green slime should cure sliming. DT responded by making it an instadeath 02:51 <@Loggers_VIII> wait, I’m confused about the quest artifact thing. You wanted Rodney to not steal your character’s role’s quest artifact? 02:52 Sliming consists of green slime slowly taking over your body. 02:52 Thus, if you genocide green slimes during the process, it 02:52 should probably stop. 02:53 -!- Sgeo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:54 Yes Loggers 02:54 <@Loggers_VIII> well that’s just silly isn’t it 02:54 i don't think i even looked at that email - not really something that interested me 02:55 loggers: i think i saw that death, are you supposed to kill arthur? 02:55 <@fredriq> @Loggers_VIII I wanted Rodney to not steal your quest arti, but possibly steal other roles. This would help making roles somewhat more distinct, because it means that each role can rely on their own artifact to always be usable. Currently the optimal strategy for some roles is to stash their artifact and not use it past Rodney, which makes the standard "ascension kit" more homogenous. DT responded by making him steal all quest artifacts, which is a 02:55 hard nerf generally 02:56 you're still not, but I think Loggers wanted to try the whole "kill leader and open quest" thing 02:56 <@Loggers_VIII> anselmus I was playing hackem and evilhack dark knight. I had to kill him to get my artifact since I abused alignment, and couldn’t generate excal before since dark knights can’t dip for it 02:56 ah 02:56 assumed vanilla 02:56 <@Loggers_VIII> I see what the change would do but it just doesn’t make sense 02:57 <@Loggers_VIII> I mean, plenty of roles’ strategy already revolves around their quest artifact 02:57 <@fredriq> I suppose -- but DT doing the exact opposite to the suggested change was just frustrating 02:57 <@fredriq> and as mentioned wasn't the only time it happened :p 02:58 <@Loggers_VIII> hey 02:58 Hello @Loggers_VIII, Welcome to #hardfought 02:58 <@fredriq> I still think the slime geno case is needlessly cruel to the player for trying to think up a neat solution to a problem 02:58 <@Loggers_VIII> *heh 02:59 <@Loggers_VIII> I think the slime geno should obviously kill you if you’re already a slime but it makes sense to have you survive if you do it in the process of sliming 02:59 <@fredriq> if you are already a slime, you are dead 02:59 <@fredriq> but yeah, agreed if that wasn't the case 02:59 <@Loggers_VIII> Ah that’s right it kills you 03:00 <@Loggers_VIII> I’m usually wearing life saving so I romp around as slime for a bit 03:00 <@fredriq> lol 03:00 should've probably said more about it than just "it should probably stop" 03:00 <@fredriq> paxed: I thought I was clear enough about the suggestion 03:00 but whatever, i'm on vacation, so away ---> 03:01 <@fredriq> Nowhere did I say "the player should be killed" 03:01 <@Loggers_VIII> it seems like you got epically trolled 03:02 <@Loggers_VIII> “It should probably stop” oh yeah? What if you just fucking die instead smart guy??? 03:02 <@Loggers_VIII> I jest, of course, but it is funny 03:03 @fredriq: It was my fault that your statusbar code got commented out. Something happened with the mainline code that changed the interface and it was too hard for me to integrate your code, so I rewrote/adapted the more traditional statusbar, and commented out your version with the intent of revisitning it later (I think you were unavailable at the time all this happened), and then the devteam picked 03:03 up the code as it was at the time. 03:04 <@fredriq> Tangles: I didn't mind that it was commented out. That part made sense 03:04 <@fredriq> It did, after all, rely on a patch that no longer existed 03:05 Maybe it'd be worth getting it all working again and submit a PR? 03:05 <@fredriq> But I asked DT if they'd be interested in a PR that fixed it and updated it for statushilite. They basically said "lol no" 03:05 oh ok then :/ 03:05 <@fredriq> I am not in the habit of making PRs that is going to be ignored 03:05 <@fredriq> I learned my lesson after getobj 03:12 <@fredriq> @Loggers_VIII also for a time I was worried that PatR was going to kill my sidebar code because he didn't seem to care for it whatsoever and complained about it on multiple occasions 03:12 <@fredriq> thankfully this never happened 03:12 <@Loggers_VIII> a vengeful programmer is a dangerous programmer 03:13 <@Loggers_VIII> although I doubt patr would do something like that, from what I’ve seen of him 03:13 <@fredriq> who do you think did the sliming code change? 🙂 03:14 <@Loggers_VIII> ok but that one was funi 03:14 <@Loggers_VIII> And I kind of see where he’s coming from. Though I think you should just take HP damage and possibly lose max HP. 03:15 -!- malor has joined #hardfought 03:25 <@fredriq> @Loggers_VIII you wrote demo pastebin, right? 03:26 <@fredriq> tbh I'm not convinced demo is wrong when he says removal of nutrition would have much effect on game balance 03:26 <@Loggers_VIII> yea I wrote that 03:26 <@fredriq> even if it's quite an... unorthodox idea 03:27 <@fredriq> *wouldn't have much effect 03:28 <@Loggers_VIII> Yeah it probably wouldn’t make an insane difference but I kind of just like eating stuff lol 03:29 <@fredriq> he was suggesting removing nutrition 03:29 <@fredriq> presumably not corpses 03:29 <@fredriq> for trinsics 03:30 <@fredriq> tbh I think the biggest impact would be the exact reverse case; being able to eat corpses indiscriminatorily 03:30 <@Loggers_VIII> Yeah but I mean even just eating to get satiated. There’s something inherently satisfying about it to me. Maybe I’m the crazy one 03:30 <@Loggers_VIII> Yeah that would be pretty crazy 03:30 nutrition is pretty important in the early game. maybe it wouldn't change game balance, but it would change the game. 03:31 <@fredriq> fwiw I'm not saying we should remove nutrition 03:31 <@fredriq> just that I don't think demo is on crazy when he said that 😛 03:32 <@Loggers_VIII> Idk sounds like crazy talk to me 03:32 <@fredriq> haha 03:33 <@fredriq> YANI: limit summon amount to Cha/3 03:34 <@fredriq> I think my next endeavour in fiqhack will be to implement special abilities 03:35 <@fredriq> or as slash'em calls them, techniques 03:35 -!- cathartes has quit [Quit: fly away] 03:36 <@Loggers_VIII> hah techniques are goofy 03:36 <@Loggers_VIII> I like em 03:36 <@fredriq> some ideas I had: monk ability that continuously doubles their martial arts damage until they fail to land an attack that action (either because they missed, or didn't attack) 03:36 <@Loggers_VIII> fuck the monk directional inputs ones though those suck 03:36 <@Loggers_VIII> that’s fun 03:37 <@fredriq> wizard ability that sap magic from the air, draining Pw from foes and giving them to you 03:38 <@fredriq> tourist ability to throw a party, temporarily pacifying everything in range until someone is hurt 03:41 <@fredriq> barbarian ability that gives a temporary buff to attack for several turns, arc ability that detects enchanted loot on the level, priests already have an ability (turn undead), valk ability to freeze a nearby area dealing cold damage scaled on distance 03:41 <@fredriq> those are just some ideas and could probably be better 03:42 <@Loggers_VIII> You know what would be a cool one for barb would be to give all attacks a cleaver style arc temporarily 03:42 <@fredriq> but the overall idea was: give each role an ability, give each unique demon an ability 03:42 <@Loggers_VIII> Not sure how hard that would be to implement but a fun Yano 03:42 <@Loggers_VIII> *yani 03:42 <@fredriq> I did consider that actually 03:42 <@fredriq> for barb 03:42 [hdf-eu] [dnh] Vis (Bin Hum Mal Non) entered Minetown for the first time, on T:3008 03:42 <@fredriq> but I figured they'd be using cleaver anyway 03:42 <@fredriq> that renders it redundant 03:42 <@fredriq> maybe it would make cleaver's arc wider 03:43 <@fredriq> (if they used cleaver I mean, a cleaver-style arc for other weapons) 03:43 <@fredriq> samurai ability to displace a hostile monster, dealing damage and stunning them in the process 03:44 <@fredriq> caveman ability to greatly boost stone throwing range and damage 03:45 <@fredriq> idk what to do about knights 03:45 <@Loggers_VIII> Samurai one could have some cool applications 03:45 <@Loggers_VIII> Caveman ability is redundant as always :p 03:45 <@fredriq> knights really stumped me when I thought about this earlier 03:45 <@Loggers_VIII> hm 03:45 <@fredriq> I suppose they could get an ability that makes their steed attack alongside them 03:45 <@fredriq> for a time 03:46 <@fredriq> including stuff like dragonbreathing 03:46 <@fredriq> as in, each attack, or maybe action in general, gives their steed a free attack opportunity 03:47 <@Loggers_VIII> Oh that could be fun 03:47 <@Loggers_VIII> What about wiz 03:47 <@Loggers_VIII> Oh you already said wiz 03:47 <@fredriq> I gave it above 03:47 <@fredriq> sap magic from the surroundings, reducing pw from nearby monsters and giving it to the wiz 03:47 maybe cavemen could have a "primal rage" type ability 03:47 <@fredriq> useless unless fighting another caster 03:47 not one that super evolves pets though 03:48 <@fredriq> Umbire: what would it do 03:48 [hdf-eu] [nh370] MalkMcJorma (Pri Elf Fem Cha) acquired the Mines' End luckstone, on T:3692 03:48 I mean I'm still thinking of it, this was stream of though :B 03:48 thought* 03:48 <@fredriq> ahh 03:48 but my inclination was basically an at-will berserk? 03:49 <@fredriq> that was my initial suggestion for barbarian 03:49 with a bonus if you're bare-handed 03:49 <@fredriq> could give it to cavemen, double speed and bonus damage for a time 03:49 and another if at low-health, stackable possibly 03:49 yeah 03:49 survival instinct, let's call it 03:50 <@fredriq> idk if I'd give them names, I was thinking of just placing it on #monster 03:50 <@fredriq> also, demons would each get an unique ability 03:50 <@fredriq> to make them more distinct 03:50 <@fredriq> they are way too similar atm 03:51 more "basis for flavor" than a name suggestion :B 03:51 <@fredriq> ahh ok 03:51 xnh is doing pretty good at distinguishing them, evil to a lesser extent 03:51 dnh of course but then it does Everything™ different 03:52 <@Loggers_VIII> I like evil’s barbed devil and xnh has a cool ice devil 03:52 what does xnh do with it now 03:52 @?ice devil 03:52 ice devil (&) | Lvl: 11 | Diff: 14 | Spd: 6 | Res: fire cold poison drain | Confer: nothing | MR: 55 | Gen: gehennom | AC: -4 | Atk: 1d4 claw physical, 1d4 claw physical, 2d4 bite physical, 3d4 sting cold | Align: -12 | seeinvis, poisonous, demon, stalker, infravis, silverhate 03:52 @x?ice devil 03:52 ice devil (&) | Lvl: 11 | Diff: 14 | Spd: 6 | Res: fire cold poison drain | Confer: nothing | MR: 55 | Gen: gehennom | AC: -4 | Atk: 1d4 claw physical, 1d4 claw physical, 2d4 bite physical, 3d4 sting cold | Align: -12 | seeinvis, poisonous, demon, stalker, infravis, silverhate 03:53 <@Loggers_VIII> I may be going insane because I totally thought xnh gave it a slowing attack 03:53 <@fredriq> I'd probably give ice devils an ability that encases foes in ice, making them unable to move 03:53 I mean probably did, dunno how up to date its pino entries are 03:54 <@Loggers_VIII> Like chillbugs from un? 03:54 <@fredriq> (but still do other things) 03:54 <@Loggers_VIII> Is that what they’re called 03:54 <@fredriq> maybe? I don't remember what those do 03:54 chillbugs are in quite a few variants but I think that's un-specific, yeah 03:54 <@Loggers_VIII> Pretty sure they encase foes in ice making them unable to move lol 03:54 <@fredriq> haha ok 😛 03:55 I think I had a YANI about ice-flavored petrification occurring if you get wasted by a strong enough cold attack 03:55 <@Loggers_VIII> Here’s a YANI for you make Asmodeus’ cold attack ignore half of cold resistance 03:55 you mean damage halved by cold res or 03:55 <@fredriq> I have that idea for asmo already lol 03:56 <@Loggers_VIII> Always one step ahead 03:56 <@Loggers_VIII> Umbire basically if you have cold res he still deals half of what he normally would and isn’t 100% negated 03:56 <@fredriq> instadeath w/o cold res, severe damage with resistance, less with "immunity" 03:56 so damage halved 03:57 [hdf-eu] [nh370] MalkMcJorma (Pri Elf Fem Cha) chose an elven dagger to be named "Sting", on T:4210 03:57 <@Loggers_VIII> Vanilla demon bosses piss me off 03:57 <@Loggers_VIII> Why are you all so WEAK 03:57 so they can clown you with knockback hits 03:57 <@Loggers_VIII> Okay knockback is a funny addition 03:57 <@Loggers_VIII> I support it 03:57 [hdf-us] [nh370] Prokythera (Mon Hum Fem Cha) entered Sokoban, on T:6454 03:58 <@Loggers_VIII> but they’re such speed bumps, man… it makes me sad 03:58 <@Loggers_VIII> I just want to fight strong monsters is that so much to ask 03:59 <@Loggers_VIII> Honestly my #1 hoped for change for vanilla is making the demon bosses scary 03:59 <@shadow_rider> simply don’t get cold resistance 03:59 <@shadow_rider> boom scary fight 03:59 <@Loggers_VIII> Maybe #2 is getting some new artis 03:59 <@Loggers_VIII> If you do it like that he’s harder than anything evilhack has to offer 04:00 <@Loggers_VIII> @?asmodeus 04:00 Asmodeus (&) | Lvl: 105 | Diff: 53 | Spd: 12 | Res: fire cold poison drain | Confer: nothing | MR: 90 | Gen: unique | AC: -7 | Atk: 4d4 claw physical, 6d6 cast cold | Align: 20 | flies, seeinvis, poisonous, nopoly, demon, stalker, covetous, infravis, silverhate 04:00 <@shadow_rider> there ya go 04:00 <@shadow_rider> boss fight in vanilla 04:00 <@Loggers_VIII> Why are you lying to me pinobot 04:00 <@Loggers_VIII> Anyway I did that once and got oneshot never again 04:00 <@fredriq> YANI: Insects on Baalzebub's level are twice as fast and deal twice the damage. Baalzebub's special ability is the vanilla "summon insects" spell 04:00 <@shadow_rider> i survived on 3 hp 04:01 <@shadow_rider> teleport wand workedsomehow 04:01 <@Loggers_VIII> lol 04:01 [hdf-eu] [nh370] nmlkj (Wiz Hum Mal Cha), 1628 points, T:2471, killed by a dagger 04:01 <@Loggers_VIII> YANI: every demon boss is just replaced with demogorgon 04:01 <@Loggers_VIII> demohack 04:01 <@fredriq> ha 04:02 <@fredriq> @Loggers_VIII you think my idea is overkill? :p 04:02 <@Loggers_VIII> No I like your idea 04:02 <@Loggers_VIII> In fact triple the speed and damage 04:02 <@fredriq> I have plans to rework gehennom so that once you enter a lair, you can only leave through a portal, not defended by the demon lord. Once you leave, you can't come back 04:03 <@Loggers_VIII> AND make baalz count as an insect. 04:03 <@Loggers_VIII> heehee baalz 04:03 <@fredriq> Once you have the Amulet, every undefeated demon lord invokes debuffs against you 04:03 <@Loggers_VIII> Oh hey that’s like xnh 04:03 [hdf-eu] [hackm] mobileuser (Sam Dwa Mal Law) had Kiku-ichimonji bestowed upon him by Amaterasu Omikami, on T:10157 (4:36:00) 04:03 <@fredriq> Yeah we had the same idea, I learned a while back 04:04 <@Loggers_VIII> In xnh it was bugged so Juiblex never was defeated so I got his debuff even though I killed all the demons, lol 04:04 <@fredriq> baalz debuff would probably be to make the lair-specific insect debuff apply for the entire dungeon, and periodically surround you with insects 04:04 <@Loggers_VIII> I killed him 25 times 04:04 <@Loggers_VIII> Oh yes that sounds fun 04:05 <@Loggers_VIII> Honestly that sounds like it would make astral hard at 04:05 <@Loggers_VIII> *af 04:05 <@fredriq> asmo would be to slow you down due to cold (not the typical "Slow" intrinsic) 04:05 <@shadow_rider> what’s the variants that make juiblex split a million times with edged weapon 04:05 <@fredriq> juiblex would periodically make you Ill 04:05 <@shadow_rider> that was a nightmare 04:05 <@Loggers_VIII> I know xnh does and maybe grunt 04:05 <@Loggers_VIII> And vanilla soon 04:06 <@Loggers_VIII> Either grunt or spork 04:06 <@fredriq> @Loggers_VIII the ability suggestion above was intended as a player buff in part to compensate for demon debuffs 04:06 <@fredriq> but you could always, you know, not leave the demon lord alive 🙂 04:06 <@Loggers_VIII> Yeah just kill ‘em 04:07 <@Loggers_VIII> More fun that way anyway 04:07 <@Loggers_VIII> Ah, a sentence where I would’ve benefited from using “anyhow”. I never thought I’d see the day. 04:08 <@fredriq> you do know how fiqhack astral works, right? 😛 04:08 <@fredriq> I don't think it'd make much difference 04:08 <@Loggers_VIII> Enlighten me 04:08 <@fredriq> summons: the game 04:08 <@Loggers_VIII> ah 04:08 <@fredriq> you saw the convo yesterday with hothraxxa? 04:09 <@fredriq> they said fiqhack astral still has a million summons 04:09 <@fredriq> even after all the nerfs 04:09 <@Loggers_VIII> I remember him ranting a bit about astral in fiq yeah 04:09 <@Loggers_VIII> huh that was yesterday want it 04:09 <@Loggers_VIII> *WASN’T 04:09 <@fredriq> but they were also unaware that magic whistles still worked just fine 04:09 <@fredriq> if you blessed them 04:09 <@Loggers_VIII> tweet tweet 04:09 <@fredriq> I suspect their ranting would have been lessened if they knew that lol 04:10 <@Loggers_VIII> lol 04:10 <@Loggers_VIII> well anyhow it’s like 3 am and I should probably go to sleep 04:10 <@fredriq> see you 04:10 <@Loggers_VIII> Later o/ 04:13 is monster summoning/spellcasting unlimited? 04:13 or based on power or something 04:16 <@fredriq> anselmus: are you talking about vanilla or fiqhack here? 04:17 <@fredriq> fiqhack monsters use player spells, create monster was replaced with summoning 04:17 <@fredriq> like any spell, it uses pw 04:17 just in general 04:17 <@fredriq> in vanilla it works very, very differently 04:18 you were talking about symmetry so i thought maybe monsters should be restricted like the player 04:19 -!- joes has joined #hardfought 04:21 <@fredriq> monsters have an "cast spell" attack. Each time a monster attacks the player, they cast a random monster "directional" or nondirectional spell. The spell chosen is random. If mspec_used is nonzero, or if the randomized spell is inappropriate (healing at full HP etc), the monster "points at you, then curses" if the randomized spell is directional, "points all around, then curses" if nondirectional. If a monster didn't attack, they roll a nondirectional 04:21 spell. If appropriate, they cast it and use their turn. Otherwise, they move like any other monster. A failed spellcast (happens if lowlevel sometimes, or if cancelled) gives "The air crackles around the monster" 04:22 [hdf-eu] [nh370] MalkMcJorma (Pri Elf Fem Cha) murdered Blackfell, her faithful kitten, on T:5512 04:22 <@fredriq> anselmus: "restricted like the player" what do you mean? 04:23 <@fredriq> monster and playuer spellcasting works the exact same in fiqhack 04:23 <@fredriq> minus spell hunger 04:23 i think that answers my question 04:23 <@fredriq> they can even maintain spells 04:23 <@fredriq> like you can 04:24 introducing hunger for hostiles would be a whole new layer of nonsense 04:24 <@fredriq> too much of a hassle imo 04:24 might make nutrition way more relevant if they can eat food before you find it :B 04:24 <@fredriq> so I skipped that 04:24 naturally 04:24 <@fredriq> but otherwise they work identically 04:25 and i guess it would kinda silly for a rodney or an arch L to be low on pw 04:25 <@fredriq> (Double Trouble can't be maintained, if anyone is curious) 04:25 <@fredriq> anselmus: they can run out, just like the player 04:25 <@fredriq> but they have a large pw reserve 04:25 yeah a lot of variants give monsters actual pw banks 04:25 also DT is a fully autonomous clone so that makes sense 04:26 <@fredriq> this is why one suggestion I gave hothraxxa was "wait out the summonstorm, monsters run out of Pw eventually" 04:26 <@fredriq> it regenerates of course, but they spam spells faster than that 04:27 <@fredriq> in fact, there is a chance that making summons limited to Cha/3 would be a buff 04:27 <@fredriq> to monsters 04:27 they'd stop summoning sooner and whip out the bullshit 04:27 <@fredriq> because, now unable to summon more than 4 monsters, they'll use other spells 04:27 Dispater effect 04:27 <@fredriq> and the moment it becomes less than 4, they'd promptly just cast summon again 04:28 <@fredriq> so perversely, such a nerf could make astral worse! 04:30 [hdf-us] [dnh] Jack (Hdr-Wiz Dro Mal Law) became the Shepherd of the Black Web, on T:64801 04:33 still not sure i understand symmetry, sometimes it sounds like making the monsters equal to the player, other times like letting monsters have the same opportunities as the player 04:33 [hdf-eu] [nh370] MalkMcJorma (Pri Elf Fem Cha) entered Sokoban, on T:6342 04:34 It's a mix of both to my limited knowledge 04:34 because i think the two are very different ideas 04:38