00:01 [hdf-us] [dyn] Bourne (Wiz Elf Mal Cha), 1353 points, T:3715, killed by a lynx 00:03 lol 00:03 stenno: Message from {Demo} at 2021-01-24 19:48 EST: who runs the nhqb? 00:03 {Demo}: still awake? 00:04 stenno: did you sleep 00:04 i haven't gone to bed yet XD 00:04 {Demo}: nice find 00:04 i was too pumped and then i watched the stream 00:04 well the recording 00:04 i mean i started watching, haven't seen all yet 00:04 i see you people analyzed all the mistakes i made lol 00:04 the hobbit thing 00:05 if i force-fight a hobbit, wont he scream and wake up the zoo 00:05 yeah im reviewing my own mistakes and tips from the vid too 00:05 {Demo}: i found a few other interesting things 00:05 lot of things i could have done differently 00:05 altho the main thing was zapping that wand at myself, that basically cost me the first good run lol 00:05 so dumb 00:06 well it was a typo, wasn't it 00:06 no 00:06 i was use-testing 00:06 its not that you thought to yourself imma cancel myself 00:06 oh.. 00:06 i forgot sometimes the x gets scuffed 00:06 before you try the wand 00:06 if you're not paying a lot of attention, which i wasn't, you don't notice that you're writing fresh 00:07 regarding the werefoo and holy water thing, i was well aware of that but it was my only holy water 00:07 when i went back and watched it saw, i wasn't "adding" but fresh engrave 00:07 so i didn't want to use it up 00:07 yeah 00:07 stenno: i would have just used it and gone back to the altar 00:07 yep 00:07 unless you found it in a shop 00:07 then rip 00:07 well i don't remember the origins of that one 00:07 anyway there was also no need to use test wands by zapping at myself 00:07 all those wnads you id like that are quite shit 00:07 and i was on the asc run already lol 00:07 thats true 00:08 Finds o: 00:08 its just muscle memory 00:08 What's this about finds 00:08 habit i would say 00:08 muscle memory is even more automatic 00:08 imo 00:08 Umbire: php being php 00:08 but its a thin line 00:08 o 00:08 sometimes 00:08 rite I remember now 00:08 Anyway how's everyone 00:08 its also true what they said, that i should have stoipped to think more when wizard double troubled on dl1 00:08 i think i just panicked 00:08 like 'first engrave with finger, then engrave with wand, if no message, zap at self, if still no message, name "nomsg"' 00:09 and i kinda saw the run as lost from the moment i fucked up with that cancel wand tbh 00:09 aoei: i wondered if you could have maybe c!oGL to earth 00:09 yea i saw your comment 00:09 it might have work3ed 00:09 if i lucked into the pot being cursed 00:09 i was convinced that after cancelling it was still winnable 00:09 i had no means to curse it 00:09 after the self cancel 00:09 stenno: winnable yes 00:09 but very low chance 00:09 i think 00:10 Lack of resources would've killed her on the PLanes 00:10 Planes* 00:10 well surely a lower chance than before 00:10 I would have survived til astral 00:10 quite possibly 00:10 but astral i dont see how i could have beat 00:10 no death charges or anything 00:10 Astral's a Plane 4Head 00:10 you had conflict though? 00:10 and yeah 00:10 those death wand charges were vital 00:10 conflict isn't enough with no death wands, no tele wands 00:10 ^ 00:10 and -5 AC lol 00:10 death wand is not required 00:11 also +0 Excal isn't great 00:11 tele wand probably more 00:11 tho the weapon isn't the main thing 00:11 hp was like 160 ? 00:11 so 320 with oof 00:11 yeah the death wand isn't super important but you need to be able to avoid the riders or tele other monsters 00:11 yeah my hp was ok but idk 00:11 it would have been really difficult 00:11 i think 00:11 but yea i might have made it 00:11 its possible 00:11 would be a nice challenge to set up that run in wizmode and see 00:12 haha i guess so 00:12 you could trial all kinds of weird builds on astral in wizmode 00:12 if you really wanted to 00:12 i think i would have won without problems with an acceptable time if i didn't try to speedrun lol 00:12 so many typos and stress-induced mistakes 00:12 i thought about playing more conservatively 00:12 like get crowned or some shit 00:12 but then i decided to try and speedrun anyway 00:13 like you can be chill and get sub-3h 00:13 i tried to streak valk with really conservative play 00:13 got crowned and was crazy stacked for asc 00:13 -29 AC and shit 00:13 still did it sub-5h lol 00:13 yep 00:14 stenno: im gonna go to teh gas station now 00:14 to buy my victory beer 00:14 they will think i am an alcoholic i guess 00:14 hahaha 00:14 but i didnt go to bed yet so i think its okay 00:15 i guess you are working today' 00:15 yeah lets see what happens today 00:16 maybe i can do some running tonight 00:16 i still really want to beat your 3.6.6 record on nao 00:16 i actually have a decent start saved 00:16 30 mins used 00:16 3.6.6 is the past 00:16 wallclock will be days already 00:16 what is my 3.6.6 record? 00:16 stenno: nah stable is still legit 00:16 let me check 00:16 you got 2h 29min on 3.6.1 00:17 i just group them by major version 00:17 so i will be happy with anything under 150 minutes on 3.6.6 00:17 lol ok 00:17 i also want to break sub-2h at some point hopefully 00:17 considering skipping soko for that 00:17 me too 00:17 soko takes me 10 minutes if im really quick 00:17 soko is like 10 minutes or so 00:18 but if you wanna break sub-2h 10 minutes is significant 00:18 and soko is optional 00:18 imo 00:18 well sometimes you just _can_ skip it if you get early refl and boh 00:18 for consistency you want soko 00:18 but for just breaking sub-2h at all cost you don't need to be consistent 00:18 you should def. check out the first and second level at least 00:18 you luck into some stuff on a good run 00:18 yeah probably 00:18 for a couple of wands and rings yeah 00:18 and ?oEarth 00:19 right 00:19 those are useful 00:19 its more important now for vlad i think 00:19 he's annoying if you don't block the staircase 00:20 lol in one of my runs i tried to block the stairs for surtur with a boulder 00:20 doesn't really work with surtur XD 00:20 looooooooooooooooool 00:20 galaxy brained it 00:21 :D 00:21 anyway brb 00:22 same 00:28 blork 00:31 blook 00:34 napsta 00:45 -!- Deathsushi has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 00:54 [hdf-us] [un] Alex (Kni Hum Fem Law), 7586 points, T:7842, killed by a gray unicorn 00:59 <@riker> !8ball 00:59 @riker: Reply hazy try again 00:59 <@riker> !8ball 00:59 @riker: Don't count on it 01:01 sup riker 01:02 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 01:04 Hi riker and raisse 01:06 hey raisse o/ 01:10 <@riker> o/ 01:10 <@riker> needed an 8ball for something and beholder was convenient :) 01:10 <@riker> and I'm almost always here, you just need to ping me properly 01:11 :o 01:11 how do i ping you properly 01:11 <@riker> @riker 01:11 @riker like this 01:11 jinx 01:11 potion of soda right the fuck now 01:11 <@riker> bot still broken that dont work 01:11 <@riker> @riker #8103 no space? 01:12 @riker#8103 test 01:12 <@riker> nah ok bot just broke lmao 01:12 <@riker> one of yall wanna try in nh variants or NH discord channels? 01:14 <@riker> couldve sworn the bot worked at one point 01:14 <@riker> !tell riker @riker 01:14 Will do, @riker! 01:14 <@riker> . 01:14 @riker: Message from @riker at 2021-01-25 01:14 EST: @riker 01:14 <@riker> :/ 01:16 @mtf maybe the bot should put webhooks back in? 01:18 <@riker> @mtf 01:20 <@riker> it's a bit ironic your original msg didnt even ping mtf lol 01:30 a bit! 01:47 stenno: i think its also possible to speedrun as atheist valk 01:47 god is not that important, you can wish for blessed/cursed marker and/or do the confused blessed remove curse trick 01:48 and sometimes the tempation to BUC test things at an altar actually slows me down 01:49 fastest runs will probably break any conducts that give an edge to break, but i dont think theism is that imporant for valk 01:49 the only real issue is holy water 01:49 Yeah, once you have enough by whatever method you're set 01:50 do most speedvalks bother with priest protection actually 01:51 i wouldn't, because if you're gonna use HoOA for asc run you'll lose it anyway 01:51 clairvoyance is useful 01:52 but not a huge loss 01:52 also if you do atheist strats and go for confused blessed remove curse you are definitely gonna have unholy water too 01:52 yeah I just felt the need to ask since I missed VotD 01:52 I noticed a lot of my speedvalks only get holy 01:52 and no unholy 01:52 and uhhhhhh 01:52 what was I gonna say... 01:53 which bit of votd did you miss 01:53 all of it lol 01:53 ah 01:53 anyway I forgotted :c 01:53 in my run that ascended i used the confused blessed remove curse trick anyway 01:53 like i had holy but i really wanted unholy too 01:54 you can sometimes get it from fountain dipping but it's not super reliable and trying for it also takes time 01:54 and also RNg 01:54 RNG* 01:54 yea 01:54 if you have enough water the confused blessed remove curse thing is essentially guaranteed to give you holy and uholy 01:54 its a bit annoying splitting the water stack 01:54 but pretty efficient 01:59 ye 01:59 saves time down the line 02:12 <@luxidream> stenno: whether monster screams or not depends on ms tag 02:12 <@luxidream> hobbits simply get angry 02:15 <@luxidream> atheist is possible, but good luck finding holy remove curse lol 02:16 <@luxidream> I’m quite certain that aoei‘s last situation was a loss because I’ve been there before without the canceling 02:16 <@luxidream> You simply aren’t able to kill the wizard 02:17 <@luxidream> this would have been compounded without portal detection 02:17 <@luxidream> !who 02:17 @luxidream: [hdf-us] guest99987 [slshm] tinklebear [nh370] | [hdf-eu] No current players | [hdf-au] Arahael [evil] 02:18 [hdf-au] [evil] Arahael (Wiz Ith Fem Cha), 733 points, T:1167, poisoned by an orc zombie 02:18 Poison insta-death - never even saw it. 02:19 Woah. *random* dragonbane in the first room in the new game! 02:19 Don't splat this one or you'll really be sorry 02:20 I won't be splatting this one! 02:20 Even have a bone helm on dlvl1, this is insane. 02:21 bonehelmer 02:22 I think I can probably ignore the mines, even, at least until I'm leveled up. 02:22 Usually I feel I'm forced to do the mines for food and armour. 02:23 lux: yea true, the portals would have been a huge problem 02:23 lux: also the strat is to wish for one holy marker to write remove curse with 02:23 you do have to know remove curse though 02:23 or polypile for it 02:24 so it's not a sure thing exactly 02:24 aoei: Why is it so important? 02:24 <@luxidream> That’s not a bad backup actually 02:25 lux: i did it in my winning run because i wanted unholy for some reason 02:25 <@luxidream> I’ll strongly consider that for games with no altar 02:25 but it's nice in that it gives you both 02:25 yea, do consider as backup 02:25 normally you don't need a lot of unholy though really 02:25 it's okay without 02:26 i think it's slightly more important if you rely on cancellation wand for blanking stuff 02:26 which i do like because it's way faster than dipping 02:26 <@luxidream> valk doesn’t actually need to curse tele scrolls 02:26 yeah i think i used it for geno 02:26 you might want to curse some gl pots i guess 02:26 if you luck into some 02:26 <@luxidream> Yeah that’s a good use 02:26 arahael: why is what so important? 02:27 aoei: Why is 'remove curse' so important? 02:27 <@luxidream> to get holy water without an altar 02:27 You are asking question about a scroll that are already answered by the scroll 02:27 well for the specific start we're talking about you need two blessed remove curse scrolls 02:27 strat* 02:27 and you need a confusion source 02:27 but yes the context is one of braining strats for atheist valks 02:27 then you split a bunch of water pots in main invent 02:28 which is also a solid general strat because it gives holy and unholy water 02:28 aoei: Ah, for BUC randomization. 02:28 and if you have enough separate stacks you have a near certain chance of getting holy and unholy water out of it 02:28 yes exactly 02:28 and if you're SOL with altars it's your next best idea 02:28 yeah atheist or altarless, it's the most reliable option 02:28 fountains are too RNG to be relied on 02:28 Umbire: Ah, thanks for that. 02:28 you might get water cursed with snakes instead 02:29 lol 02:29 lux: so far i finished watching the vod up to a little after the epic inventory cancel splat 02:29 thanks for all the great commentary this is really useful 02:29 i will probably try to watch the rest after i've slept 02:29 because i still haven't done that 02:30 <@luxidream> I tried 02:30 [hdf-eu] [nh370] gargor (Arc Gno Mal Neu), 486 points, T:639, killed by a wounded giant bat 02:30 you did a great job imo 02:30 <@luxidream> sometimes I was behind on the games 02:30 yeah its hard when you're doing two at once 02:30 even just watching it back i missed loads of stuff 02:30 and sometimes had to rewind lol 02:32 you can't actually pay proper attention to more than one game at once, or twitch discussion plus game 02:32 the only thing you can probably do, with practice, is rapidly alternate focus 02:32 human brains are very limited in that sense 02:33 but yea i got a lot of interesting tips from the discussions already 02:33 also it was kinda fun seeing how long i didn't notice certain things during play lol 02:33 You can sorta "queue" comments as you're reading and commentating 02:33 like lit candelabrum, not having all my armour on 02:33 but that takes exceptional memory to not lose the order on that 02:33 also the bit where i forgot to put on HoOA for a few levels on the asc run 02:33 or the info itself 02:33 yea you also can't store all that much in short term memory 02:34 which is partly why it's impossible to focus on three things at once 02:34 I mean you can but good luck 02:34 also I owe you a squirrel/axolotl art I think? 02:34 I ask because I wanted to try my hand at your winning dwarven flayer valk 02:34 if one player is just doing boring stuff then it's probably not so bad 02:34 Umbire: idk exactly what you mean but sounds cool sure :D 02:35 "formality" sections can help in that regard but in this case shit can happen at any moment 02:35 but if both games have a lot going on you will miss stuff 02:35 aoei: as in drawing them 02:35 <@luxidream> Umbire there are points that I didn’t watch because I assumed they were uninteresting 02:35 anyway you did a pretty great job trying to keep up i think 02:35 <@luxidream> Like soko zoo 02:35 yeah that's exactly what I'm saying 02:35 oh hahahaa 02:35 yeah that's a problem 02:36 next thing you know there's a hobbit in the door going on about a bloody ring 02:36 because shit can get fucked real quick in areas that look boring lol 02:36 and you die because you're too nice to boot him in the face 02:36 lol 02:37 (and for the record I blame stenno for none of that beyond the "obvious" move being evident in hindsight) 02:37 sometimes the tangential discussions also mean you lose focus on the games, but that's not necessarily a negative because i think the people watching like the talk and advice on strats right 02:37 ye, like price ID stuff 02:37 <@luxidream> Yeah it’s also about interacting with chat 02:38 i guess the thing to learn, which also probably comes with experience, is in balancing that and still keeping up with the games 02:38 like i said tho you did a pretty great job i think 02:38 it looks not easy to do 02:38 <@luxidream> Near the end I am talking about a lot of random stuff as you load up on safety items 02:38 ahahaha 02:38 yeah i was quite over careful i think 02:38 and then a load of charging scrolls i wrote got blanked anyway 02:38 lol 02:40 in that last run i knew stenno had dropped out so i wasn't super worried about ascending really fast 02:40 just wanted to make sure i actually win 02:41 I still genuinely hate that he got hosed like he did, like a mass majority of that was just RNG smiting him 02:41 <@luxidream> yeah if he just got a lamp 02:41 <@luxidream> In one of the later games 02:42 apropos of talking strategy 02:42 aoei: https://allthetropes.org/wiki/NetHack/Analysis#Orcs 02:42 I remembered your orcish rogue/wizards tidbits in particular 02:43 <@luxidream> Rogue orc is actually squishier than human 02:43 considering stat averages that's not necessarily wrong yeah 02:44 <@luxidream> The reason that orc wizard may not be is because their points don’t go to int 02:44 been meaning to factor in how starting stats are skewed for each role at some point 02:44 <@luxidream> which can lead to slightly higher str/con 02:44 <@luxidream> This doesn’t happen for orc rogue 02:44 with rogue the lower caps on physical stats might hose them a bit, yeah 02:45 granted in terms of weaknesses I'm talking poison res/starting food 02:45 not necessarily implying they're made less squishy, should still prob. fix the wording 02:45 <@luxidream> ah ok 02:45 orc rogue still gets pr from the get go 02:45 yea 02:45 which is quite nice 02:45 <@luxidream> the poison res is useful 02:45 just less early game hell 02:45 -!- mobileuser has joined #hardfought 02:45 i should try to get some rest lol 02:45 but that was super awesome 02:45 thanks lux and stenno 02:45 yo mobile 02:45 also thanks umby everyone else who watched 02:46 aoei: naito <3 thank you all for providing such a good strim 02:46 hi umbire! 02:46 belated congrats aoei :-) 02:46 -!- amateurhour has joined #hardfought 02:46 ty<3 02:46 <@luxidream> Night aoei 02:47 wb amateurhour 02:47 thx stenno! that was extremely entertaining last night 02:47 <@luxidream> glad you liked it 02:47 <@luxidream> I’ve been wanting to do this for a while 02:47 wow even luxidream is awake 02:48 thx luxidream!! 02:48 <@luxidream> It’s not so late here 🙂 02:48 loved the commentating 02:48 heh 02:48 <@luxidream> I watched some Mario 64 races and they were exciting 02:48 -!- Admin__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:48 it feels very early here :b 02:49 <@luxidream> so I thought we could do something similar with a game I actually know 02:49 nice 02:49 <@luxidream> 😄 02:52 16-star? 02:52 <@luxidream> Usually 02:53 <@luxidream> I think that’s a popular format due to being short and not requiring sblj 02:53 <@luxidream> which is a very difficult trick 02:55 BLJs in general OPhew 02:55 <@luxidream> There’s 70 for no BLJs 02:56 <@luxidream> but that’s a demanding category 03:04 is there gonna be another one? 03:07 <@luxidream> amateurhour: yeah 03:07 woot 03:07 <@luxidream> Runners want some more time to practice 03:14 -!- tinklebear has quit [Quit: "doot doodle a doot do"] 03:15 > They say that no one plays NetHack just for the fun of it. 03:15 Wondering if that's a cursed fortune cooking. Not sure... ;) 03:20 I'd imagine fortunes become cursed upon cooking 03:22 they both did really well, but I get that they'd want to do some practise 03:22 there were some great moments, so fun 03:28 it was a super cool idea even though the result on my side was less impressive 03:28 but it was so awesome that so many joined the stream 03:30 i guess it is entertaining when i make stupid mistakes :P 03:30 fair enough 03:31 i have to admit it was also very entertaining when aoei cancelled herself 03:32 stenno you gotta stop beating yourself up 03:32 we all thought you played great 03:33 :D 03:34 well i am not super depressed about it, but i see that i can improve quite a bit 03:34