00:00 -!- stenno\proc has joined #hardfought 00:04 [US] [D]: EndlessMike (Kni-Hum-Mal-Law), 1658 points, 1885 turns, killed by a riding accident 00:04 [US] [D]: allanb (Wiz-Hum-Mal-Neu), 299 points, 535 turns, killed by a water demon 00:05 -!- stenno\proc has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:10 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed Shelob, on T:30204 00:12 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed the high shaman of Moloch, on T:30378 00:12 -!- Tangles has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 00:13 -!- Tangles has joined #hardfought 00:13 -!- mode/#hardfought [+o Tangles] by ChanServ 00:14 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed Lungorthin, on T:30457 00:15 [US] [D]: fionna (Kni-Hum-Fem-Law), 1080 points, 2560 turns, killed by a giant beetle 00:15 -!- dbanethacker has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:23 [US] [D]: allanb (Wiz-Hum-Mal-Neu), 2033 points, 3891 turns, killed by a gnome 00:30 [US] [A]: klintos (Wiz-Elf-Fem-Cha), 2248632 points, 65096 turns, ascended 00:30 https://www.hardfought.org/userdata/k/klintos/tnnt/dumplog/1572674432.tnnt.html 00:31 [R] Clan Bane of Rodney advances to rank 8! 00:32 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed Belial, on T:33520 00:32 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed Fierna, on T:33521 00:37 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed the invisible Malcanthet, on T:33842 00:40 [US] [D]: fionna (Kni-Hum-Fem-Law), 1057 points, 2225 turns, killed by a gnomish wizard 00:41 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed Baalzebub, on T:34035 00:42 [US] [D]: ShivanHunter (Wiz-Elf-Mal-Cha), 63 points, 190 turns, killed by a sewer rat (and 27 other games not reported) 00:45 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed Baphomet, on T:34363 00:49 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed Glasya, on T:34741 00:52 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed Daemon, on T:34949 00:53 [US] [D]: fionna (Kni-Hum-Fem-Law), 276 points, 1673 turns, killed by a large kobold 00:55 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed Cerberus, on T:35317 00:56 [hdf-us] [nh363] lordjoe (Pri Hum Mal Law), 2402 points, T:4677, killed by a dwarf zombie 00:56 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) destroyed Vlad the Impaler, on T:35427 00:56 [US] [D]: k2 (Arc-Hum-Mal-Law), 3138 points, 2773 turns, killed by a rothe 01:00 Current Day as of 2019-11-06 06:00 UTC: Games: 263, Asc: 5, Scum: 210. 410989 turns, 12833425 points. 5d 01:40 gametime. (38%Wiz), (53%Hum), (40%Cha), (51%Mal), 24d 17:59 remaining. 01:03 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 01:04 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:36009 01:06 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) performed the invocation, on T:36145 01:06 [US] [D]: k2 (Arc-Hum-Mal-Law), 691 points, 1169 turns, killed by a brown mold (and one other game not reported) 01:07 <@rikersan> oh he appeared on time this game 01:07 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed the elder priest of Moloch, on T:36209 01:08 [US] [D]: k2 (Arc-Hum-Mal-Law), 117 points, 284 turns, killed by a jackal 01:09 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) wished for "blessed fixed greased arkenstone", on T:36278 01:12 [US] [A]: Luxidream (Sam-Hum-Fem-Law), 1322082 points, 37198 turns, ascended (and one other game not reported) 01:12 https://www.hardfought.org/userdata/L/Luxidream/tnnt/dumplog/1573011064.tnnt.html 01:13 <@Tone> grats lux 😄 01:14 <@luxidream> thanks Tone 01:17 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) entered the Planes, on T:37526 01:21 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 523 points, 1340 turns, killed by a giant rat, while fainted from lack of food 01:21 -!- bug_sniper has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:22 [US] [D]: eraserhead97 (Mon-Hum-Fem-Law), 247178 points, 16786 turns, killed by Asmodeus 01:23 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) destroyed Pestilence, on T:37868 01:23 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) killed the invisible Center of All, on T:37886 01:24 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) destroyed Famine, on T:37919 01:26 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non) destroyed Death, on T:38008 01:26 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikersan (Bin Bat Mal Non), 8014807 points, T:38032, ascended https://www.hardfought.org/userdata/r/rikersan/dnethack/dumplog/1572999561.dnh.txt 01:26 <@rikersan> full tour 01:26 <@rikersan> bat people are fun 01:27 <@luxidream> gg 01:27 <@rikersan> that should be 9 keys too, I think I ascended with all 1st and 2nds, 3rds went to the VOTD 01:28 <@rikersan> and interestingly enough - that's survivor, normally I burn hella "oLS 01:29 <@Tone> grats riker! 01:33 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 568 points, 1160 turns, killed by a werejackal 01:34 [US] [D]: k2 (Arc-Hum-Mal-Law), 1471 points, 4999 turns, killed by a manes 01:35 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 107 points, 461 turns, killed by a falling rock 01:35 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 12 points, 112 turns, killed by a jackal 01:37 [hdf-us] [nh363] lordjoe (Rog Hum Fem Cha), 1213 points, T:2481, killed by a crossbow bolt 01:38 -!- tonehack has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:39 <@rikersan> ty tone, luxi 01:44 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 469 points, 2260 turns, killed by a manes 01:45 <@ShivanHunter> lol I found a wand of wishing 01:45 -!- LarienTelrunya has joined #hardfought 01:45 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v LarienTelrunya] by ChanServ 01:47 <@ShivanHunter> hardfought lagging for anyone else or is it comcast again 01:47 <@luxidream> comcast 01:47 <@ShivanHunter> bleh, brb 01:51 [US] [D]: k2 (Arc-Hum-Mal-Law), 544 points, 2068 turns, killed by a coyote 02:00 <@ShivanHunter> orctowwwwwwn 02:01 -!- stenno\proc has joined #hardfought 02:05 [US] [D]: Grouchy (Wiz-Elf-Mal-Cha), 7399 points, 7356 turns, killed by a large cat 02:06 -!- stenno\proc has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:09 -!- TheGame20___ has joined #hardfought 02:11 -!- theRaisse has joined #hardfought 02:11 -!- TheGame20 has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 02:12 -!- raisse has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 02:14 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 887 points, 3059 turns, killed by a gecko, while frozen by a monster's gaze 02:14 -!- theRaisse is now known as raisse 02:17 [AU] [D]: djm2000 (Wiz-Elf-Mal-Cha), 1797 points, 3533 turns, killed by a killer bee 02:22 [US] [D]: fionna (Kni-Hum-Fem-Law), 896 points, 3197 turns, killed by a rabid rat, while praying 02:23 -!- TheGame20___ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:27 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 1003 points, 2038 turns, killed by a Woodland-elf (and one other game not reported) 02:30 -!- Muad has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:32 aosdict: oh my god why did you block magicbymccauley's sock account for only 3 days, his original account was blocked *permanently* so any sockpuppets should also be banned permanently; history has shown that he just waits out the ban otherwise and then the trolling resumes where it left off 02:32 LarienTelrunya: Message from bug_sniper at 2019-11-04 22:33 EST: guess it's time to start logging channels 02:32 LarienTelrunya: Message from bug_sniper at 2019-11-04 22:34 EST: alternatively, start adding the nice patch ideas you've been overlooking while digging out the evil patch ideas 02:33 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 104 points, 328 turns, killed by a large mimic 02:33 [AU] [A]: Numbgoon (Tou-Hum-Mal-Neu), 3089610 points, 48129 turns, ascended 02:33 https://au.hardfought.org/userdata/N/Numbgoon/tnnt/dumplog/1572589686.tnnt.html 02:34 -!- Muad has joined #hardfought 02:34 [R] Clan #pray advances to rank 9! 02:36 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 127 points, 842 turns, killed by a jackal, while fainted from lack of food 02:39 [EU] [D]: amateurhour (Mon-Hum-Mal-Cha), 255 points, 819 turns, killed by a gas spore's explosion 02:44 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 1282 points, 1353 turns, killed by a giant bat (and one other game not reported) 02:59 @?lurker above 02:59 lurker above (t) | Lvl: 10 | Diff: 12 | Spd: 3 | Res: none | Confers: nothing | MR: 0 | Generates: sheol gehennom dungeons | AC: 3 | Attacks: 1d8 engulf digest | Alignment: 0 | Flags: genocidable, carnivore, flies, stalker 03:07 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 3192 points, 5396 turns, killed by a rabid rat 03:17 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 814 points, 1949 turns, killed by a straw golem, while fainted from lack of food 03:19 [EU] [D]: Dins (Pri-Elf-Fem-Cha), 130 points, 539 turns, killed by a giant mimic 03:25 [EU] [D]: Dins (Pri-Hum-Fem-Cha), 119 points, 608 turns, killed by a dwarf 03:28 <@luxidream> looool mccauley 2? 03:29 -!- spontiff has joined #hardfought 03:31 -!- Chris_ANG has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:42 -!- truculent has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 03:44 -!- Chris_ANG has joined #hardfought 03:44 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v Chris_ANG] by ChanServ 04:00 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 4280 points, 13470 turns, killed by a giant beetle 04:02 -!- stenno\proc has joined #hardfought 04:10 -!- merlZzz is now known as merlek 04:12 -!- Chris_ANG has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:15 -!- Xjs has joined #hardfought 04:18 [EU] [D]: joes (Pri-Elf-Fem-Cha), 500 points, 1084 turns, killed by a rothe 04:19 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 181 points, 673 turns, killed by a water moccasin 04:20 -!- Chris_ANG has joined #hardfought 04:20 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v Chris_ANG] by ChanServ 04:21 -!- elenmirie_ has joined #hardfought 04:21 -!- stenno\proc has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:24 -!- eLtMosen1 has joined #hardfought 04:24 -!- elenmirie__ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:24 [US] [D]: Luxidream (Wiz-Hum-Mal-Cha), 958 points, 2413 turns, killed by a cave spider 04:25 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 636 points, 1096 turns, killed by an anti-magic implosion 04:28 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 231 points, 590 turns, killed by a sewer rat 04:28 -!- Chris_ANG has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:33 -!- raisse has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:38 -!- stennowork has joined #hardfought 04:44 [US] [D]: Luxidream (Rog-Orc-Fem-Cha), 8180 points, 6656 turns, killed by a leocrotta (and one other game not reported) 04:45 [EU] [D]: rsa (Val-Dwa-Fem-Law), 636 points, 5385 turns, killed by a kobold lord, while frozen by a monster's gaze 04:53 -!- joes has joined #hardfought 04:55 -!- stenno\proc has joined #hardfought 04:57 [US] [D]: Luxidream (Wiz-Hum-Fem-Cha), 6029 points, 3102 turns, killed by a hill orc called Zuulu of Akhagoru 04:59 -!- stenno\proc has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:05 -!- Chris_ANG has joined #hardfought 05:05 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v Chris_ANG] by ChanServ 05:06 -!- spontiff has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:13 -!- spontiff has joined #hardfought 05:27 [US] [D]: richards (Val-Hum-Fem-Law), 756 points, 682 turns, killed by a bolt of lightning 05:28 -!- Chris_ANG has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:30 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:36 [US] [D]: richards (Val-Hum-Fem-Law), 433 points, 1145 turns, killed by a black pudding 05:36 [EU] [D]: Dins (Sam-Hum-Mal-Law), 6132 points, 5622 turns, killed by a soldier ant 05:40 -!- LarienTelrunya has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:40 -!- Chris_ANG has joined #hardfought 05:40 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v Chris_ANG] by ChanServ 05:41 -!- LarienTelrunya has joined #hardfought 05:41 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v LarienTelrunya] by ChanServ 05:41 -!- JonathanHanes has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:47 -!- spontiff has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:47 [EU] [D]: Dins (Arc-Dwa-Fem-Law), 55 points, 300 turns, killed by a boulder 05:51 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 05:52 -!- spontiff has joined #hardfought 05:59 [US] [D]: Luxidream (Wiz-Hum-Fem-Cha), 298 points, 279 turns, killed by a bear trap (and 5 other games not reported) 06:00 [US] [D]: Luxidream (Wiz-Hum-Fem-Cha), 38 points, 246 turns, killed by a boiling potion (and 2 other games not reported) 06:03 [EU] [D]: Dins (Bar-Orc-Fem-Cha), 917 points, 1714 turns, killed by a pony 06:04 lol is it intentional that in 3.6 you can "produce a kaleidoscopic display of floating butterfiles"? Is a "butterfile" a file covered with butter where you glue the butterflies you caught? 06:05 i doubt that its intentional, and you should submit a bug 06:05 A butterfile is a device for reducing the size of butter 06:05 heh, I've never submitted a bug, and don't know where the bug tracker page is 06:05 then i will submit it and get all the fame 06:05 heh, do it :D 06:06 and then afterwards i tell you were to do it 06:07 -!- spontiff has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:08 -!- stenno\proc has joined #hardfought 06:10 ok, submitted 06:10 -!- spontiff has joined #hardfought 06:10 LarienTelrunya, here is the beautiful contact form http://nethack.org/common/contact.html 06:11 lol that contact form requires data that can be difficult to get... all that data about the PC? I'd have to dig through the windows control panel to get those :P 06:11 i usually leave that open 06:11 and in the case of doubt, at least one of those things wouldn't be displayed under "system" 06:11 its not relevant for many bugs 06:12 (for example its not at all relevant for this bug) 06:12 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 1672 points, 3354 turns, killed by a rabid rat (and 2 other games not reported) 06:12 heh, that's what I wanted to imply :P although I do have to admit that in slex I've seen a bug that happened on windows 7 but not on XP 06:13 -!- stenno\proc has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 06:13 huh their bug list page still lists "Saving the game while both punished and engulfed can result in a corrupt save file.", I thought they had fixed that already (after all I got the fix for that from 3.6) 06:14 ooh "Saving bones with perm_invent on may result in "Bad fruit #N" warnings.", I'd love to know the fix for that because the bug is also in slex 06:14 The fix is to rewrite in c++ 06:14 obvs! 06:14 :-D 06:15 hi bubbles_nhww91! bigslex 2.57 is available on the esm server and playtesters are wanted! *bubblebubblebubble* ♥ 06:15 What's a bligslex? 06:15 oh I never told you about bigslex? wait a minute 06:15 its silly but i find the idea very awesome 06:16 this beautiful screenshot is from bigslex: https://www.reddit.com/r/slashemextended/comments/9umph2/bigslex_the_new_bigger_slex_variant_has_gone_live/ :) 06:16 Is it slex but the dungeons are 500x500? :hmm: 06:16 hahaha, not quite, but you went in the right direction ;) 06:16 So I will have to make a new terminal profile wiht a smaller font, fair enough 06:16 Hmm interesting. bigger maps. 06:17 I am trying to come up with downsides 06:17 But I can't 06:17 well one downside is that maze levels don't always construct themselves properly, e.g. the catacombs mines end variant has walls everywhere in bigslex :( 06:17 meaning without digging it's impossible to traverse 06:17 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 111 points, 547 turns, killed by a fox 06:18 also a "downside" (depending on point of view) is that fullscreen maze levels have about 3x the amount of real estate, so without mapping help it takes forever to find the stairs :P 06:21 [US] [A]: Merlek (Tou-Hum-Mal-Neu), 2940488 points, 65364 turns, ascended 06:21 https://www.hardfought.org/userdata/M/Merlek/tnnt/dumplog/1572852985.tnnt.html 06:25 ah well, gonna go home now, do some annoying household work there and then I can finally play again (hopefully)! :) 06:26 -!- LarienTelrunya has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:32 Mazes are evil 06:36 -!- ProzacElf has joined #hardfought 06:40 [EU] [D]: gargor (Val-Dwa-Fem-Law), 539 points, 1079 turns, killed by a giant ant, while fainted from lack of food 06:42 [EU] [D]: gargor (Tou-Hum-Fem-Neu), 139 points, 370 turns, killed by a giant rat 06:42 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:50 [EU] [D]: gargor (Wiz-Orc-Fem-Cha), 426 points, 1353 turns, killed by a large dog called FAMILIARIS 06:52 [EU] [D]: gargor (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 79 points, 368 turns, killed by a large mimic 06:59 [US] [D]: efot (Hea-Gno-Fem-Neu), 3067 points, 4772 turns, killed by a gas spore's explosion 07:00 Current Day as of 2019-11-06 12:00 UTC: Games: 326, Asc: 8, Scum: 220. 679963 turns, 20491717 points. 9d 03:54 gametime. (47%Wiz), (44%Hum), (38%Neu), (64%Fem), 24d 11:59 remaining. 07:01 -!- spontiff has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:02 [US] [D]: efot (Hea-Gno-Fem-Neu), 208 points, 585 turns, killed by a bolt of cold 07:09 [EU] [D]: gargor (Val-Dwa-Fem-Law), 2012 points, 3000 turns, killed by a hill orc 07:10 -!- spontiff has joined #hardfought 07:19 [EU] [D]: gargor (Tou-Hum-Fem-Neu), 592 points, 1686 turns, killed by a giant spider 07:22 [AU] [D]: DarkLightDragon (Val-Dwa-Fem-Law), 118496 points, 18292 turns, killed by a troll 07:28 -!- hdf-guest-56 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:31 -!- bubbles_nhww91 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:32 -!- bubbles_nhww has joined #hardfought 07:32 Strength 18/** behaviour, is there any reason for this other than "legacy"? 07:32 no 07:32 [US] [D]: Merlek (Val-Hum-Fem-Law), 914 points, 3035 turns, killed by a homunculus 07:32 er or rather 07:33 this is taken from DnD 07:33 so idk if you could call it 'legacy' as such 07:33 I would call that legacy 07:33 It maps onto a regular int anyway 07:33 Code-wise 07:33 I mean specifically the 18-19 behaviour 07:34 yes, this behaviour is emulated from dnd 07:34 I guess stennowork the main question is "if strength just acted like every other stat, would anyone care/miss it"? 07:34 [US] [D]: klintos (Val-Hum-Fem-Law), 784 points, 1805 turns, killed by a rothe 07:34 probably not 07:34 And it simplifies code 07:34 but you' have to rebalance a lot of monsters 07:34 giants 07:35 its probably not worth the effort to touch this imo 07:35 i would assume that this kind of change would introduce a lot of bugs 07:36 New codebase innit 07:36 Otherwise yeah I wouldn't touch! 07:36 I'm not completely mad 07:39 if you develop from scratch anyway, then it should be fine 07:39 *nods* 07:39 Thanks! 07:39 Still planning on 1-25 07:39 I guess 3-25 07:39 Trying to strike a balance between not carrying legacy for legacy reasons, but not change it too much that people don't know what's going on 07:41 [EU] [D]: gargor (Cav-Dwa-Fem-Law), 702 points, 1475 turns, killed by a wand 07:41 fair enough 07:41 thats a tight rope 07:41 [EU] [D]: gargor (Pri-Elf-Fem-Cha), 147 points, 228 turns, killed by a gnome 07:41 Yep, I'll defo fail a bit but the aim is to minimise the total amount of failure! 07:42 e.g. by nagging people in here :-) 07:42 dont worry about failure that much 07:42 in the worst case its an educational experience 07:43 indeedly! 07:43 [EU] [D]: Dins (Cav-Dwa-Mal-Law), 1437 points, 2386 turns, killed by a plains centaur 07:44 and prepare to fail because 'rewriting nethack in X language' is a meme going around for decades now 07:44 i think there is a successful ANSI-C port 07:47 oh yeah for sure 07:47 One of the big things is not being able to leverage the content 07:47 So even if the engine is sound it's quite difficult to motivate to actually churn out a game 07:48 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 9101 points, 10208 turns, killed by an invisible stalker 07:49 [US] [D]: engelson (Cav-Hum-Mal-Neu), 98 points, 531 turns, killed by a falling rock 07:50 [EU] [D]: Dins (Hea-Gno-Fem-Neu), 10 points, 205 turns, killed by a sewer rat 07:57 -!- Grasshopper has joined #hardfought 08:02 -!- stenno\proc has joined #hardfought 08:03 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 1358 points, 3296 turns, killed by a white unicorn 08:03 [AU] [D]: DarkLightDragon (Ran-Elf-Fem-Cha), 671 points, 1364 turns, killed by a giant ant 08:04 -!- merlek has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:06 -!- eLtMosen1 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 08:07 -!- stenno\proc has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:08 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 107 points, 1025 turns, killed by a newt, while fainted from lack of food 08:25 -!- LarienTelrunya has joined #hardfought 08:25 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v LarienTelrunya] by ChanServ 08:28 LarienTelrunya: I wasn't the one who originally made the call to block him permanently and paxed (who was) decided not to deal with it yesterday, so this was to stop further trolling from going on in the interim 08:29 -!- merleke has joined #hardfought 08:29 aosdict: ah I see, but you can be pretty sure that he'll sit there staring at his monitor clock waiting until it hits 20:30 on nov 8 and then resume trolling 08:29 (he = mbm, obviously) 08:30 [AU] [D]: DarkLightDragon (Ran-Elf-Fem-Cha), 254 points, 1109 turns, killed by a bat 08:30 [EU] [D]: khamul (Sam-Hum-Mal-Law), 32029 points, 10893 turns, killed by a mumak 08:31 sorry for that, bhaak 08:31 didn't read carefully enough 08:33 mbm will just access the site from another ip address to get around any bans 08:34 that and use a different user account 08:34 eventually he should tire of it 08:34 depends how strong the troll in him is 08:38 well, if the admins persistently and quickly permaban his alternate accounts he might get tired of it; if people actually engage with his shouting or (worst of all) concede any points to him, he'll troll even more 08:39 thing is, this dunderhead actually thinks he has obtained complete enlightenment and is presenting his "absolute truths" to us stupid people, because he's living in his own world where he is always right and those who disagree are evil, or something 08:39 what is that about? 08:40 stennowork: mbm, the troll that appeared on nethackwiki a while ago, and who was permabanned but now decided to be a wiseguy and come at us again with an alternate account 08:40 ouch :( 08:40 that is unpleasant 08:41 I mean, look at this garbage: https://nethackwiki.com/mediawiki/index.php?title=Talk%3AOrcus&type=revision&diff=128998&oldid=128460 08:41 that alone should be grounds for an instant perma including instant permas for any alternate accounts he registers... 08:43 wat 08:43 oh no 08:43 the particular reason I knocked him off this time was not because of the talk page stuff in particular but because he vandalized the style guide 08:43 oh was that the person who started with the artifact weapon article? 08:44 There was some older damage than that 08:46 we should edit the style guide to include a paragraph saying "If your username is 'magicbymccauley', you must TYPE EVERY OTHER SENTENCE IN ALL CAPS and SHOUT AT THE DEV TEAM for your edits to be approved", just to troll him. :P [/sarcasm] 08:49 so instead of banning him, just use a whitelist 08:49 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 1028 points, 1772 turns, killed by an orcish arrow 08:50 alex___: no, random people fairly regularly join the wiki and make helpful edits 08:51 [AU] [A]: ogmobot (Rog-Hum-Mal-Cha), 2778912 points, 40435 turns, ascended 08:51 https://au.hardfought.org/userdata/o/ogmobot/tnnt/dumplog/1572674407.tnnt.html 08:51 and one troll shouldn't be enough to have the whole wiki disable account-less editing 08:51 banning will never have any effect on a system like that 08:51 if anyone can edit, then everyone can edit 08:51 including banned people 08:52 alex___: or a multiple choice entry test, question 1: "Another wiki user disagrees with a change you made. What do you do? a) back off, b) ask politely why he disagrees, c) revert his edits without asking or d) SHOUT AT HIM FOR DARING TO QUESTION YOUR TRUTHS". Registering an account will fail (and enact an automatic 24h block) if the answer c or d 08:52 was given. :P 08:52 [R] Clan #pray advances to rank 6! 08:53 i should foudn another clan called 'rank 6' 08:53 apparently rank 6 is very popular 08:54 why is it that "one troll" shouldn't be enough though 08:54 LarienTelrunya: ah, but he took options C and D thinking "why not both?" 08:56 alex___: because then the troll would have power over us, by forcing us to change the whole system just because of him 08:57 i feel you have a very emotional connection to this. why not be pragmatic and just change a non-working system? 08:58 doesnt he have power over you anyway by making you ban him and reverse his changes all the time 08:58 blocking is a two-click process, rolling back edits is a one-click process 08:58 this feels like a kind of hypothetical discussion based on "what if magic* anonymously vandalizes the wiki" 08:58 it's not if you have to rollback again later 08:59 -!- ais523_ has joined #hardfought 09:00 yes so far mbm has sockpuppeted but not done any vpn/tor/ipspoof tricks 09:00 I mean generally, allowing anonymous access vs requiring registration vs requiring a human to whitelist you is a matter of balancing the barrier of entry. too low and you'll need to spend more resources fighting abuse, too high and you'll discourage legit use 09:01 the same thing comes up with e.g. IRC channels and requiring a registered account for them 09:01 I don't think even wikipedia uses a whitelist. 09:03 ilbelkyr: haha :D (re: taking both options) 09:07 also if mbm wanted to anonymously vandalize the wiki, he could already have done so, yet he went through the trouble of registering another sock account 09:09 I think his highly distinctive style makes anonymous attacks not much of a threat 09:10 -!- ProzacElf has joined #hardfought 09:10 [EU] [D]: Ashpool (Wiz-Gno-Mal-Neu), 3666 points, 2048 turns, killed by a killer bee 09:12 Pinkbeast: yep, everyone with more than two brain cells would immediately recognize it's him 09:12 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 2053 points, 2956 turns, killed by a jaguar 09:13 After a week in Whitby I'm not sure I have two operating brain cells 09:16 [EU] [D]: Anerag (Wiz-Elf-Fem-Cha), 3833 points, 3433 turns, killed by a hill orc called Ogthosog of Aiakhaoth 09:17 -!- raisse has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 09:18 How angry would he be if I corrected a mistake on https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/User:Magicbymccauley/Better_artifact ? 09:19 no need to further provoke or engage a troll 09:20 Grumble you're right of course 09:21 bubbles_nhww: wait, do you mean there's still leftovers of his trite on that page? if that is so, it should definitely be corrected 09:21 LarienTelrunya: No, that's in his user space 09:22 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 09:22 oh, well his user space is a place that we better don't touch at all; let him troll in there all day long, where it doesn't affect us or regular users :P 09:22 stennowork: no problem. it's unfortunate that it even happened and they lost a lot of goodwill that was left. but at least the corpse is in good hands now 09:24 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 300 points, 581 turns, killed by a gas spore's explosion 09:25 alright 09:26 Which corpse? 09:26 What happened? 09:26 sourceforge 09:26 and illicit practices they used to do 09:26 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 184 points, 595 turns, killed by a jackal 09:26 -!- hdf-guest-6 has joined #hardfought 09:27 -!- tonehack has joined #hardfought 09:27 [AU] [D]: DarkLightDragon (Wiz-Elf-Fem-Cha), 246 points, 950 turns, killed by a falling object 09:29 [EU] [D]: Hill (Arc-Hum-Mal-Neu), 128479 points, 29626 turns, killed by a captain, while praying 09:29 Wait, how did sourceforge get mixed up with Reiser? 09:30 jonadab, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SourceForge#Project_hijackings_and_bundled_malware 09:30 -!- hdf-guest-6 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:30 Oh, that stuff. 09:30 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 73 points, 1532 turns, fell into a pit 09:32 [EU] [D]: Raisse (Wiz-Gno-Fem-Neu), 91 points, 428 turns, killed by an arrow 09:33 -!- eLtMosen1 has joined #hardfought 09:34 -!- merleke has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:35 @?Demogorgon 09:35 Demogorgon (&) | Lvl: 106 | Diff: 57 | Spd: 15 | Res: fire poison drain | Confers: nothing | MR: 95 | Generates: unique | AC: -8 | Attacks: 8d6 cast spell, 1d4 sting level drain, 1d6 claw disease, 1d6 claw disease | Alignment: -20 | Flags: flies, seeinvis, poisonous, nopoly, demon, stalker, covetous, infravisible 09:40 I've always been suspicious of sourceforge; thankfully back in the day when I had the choice between that and github, I chose the latter for slex :) 09:40 (mainly because I found sf's interface to be clunky, actually) 09:43 -!- ais523_ has quit [Quit: quit] 09:43 github is microsoft now, though I imagine that doesn't matter much to you 09:44 i don't think it matters much to anyone really 09:44 well my personal opinion is that microsoft isn't as bad as its reputation 09:45 <{Demo}> there's no avoiding m$ at this point 09:45 my personal opinion is that microsoft was really terrible, but really improved in the last years 09:45 ms embraces foss now 09:45 How bad do you think this looks: https://qbin.io/unable-layers-r0wc 09:45 .net core is FOSSed, vscode is foss 09:45 Note: I did a schema so if you typo you get squiggles 09:45 Terminal is foss 09:46 * stennowork prefers json to xml 09:46 <{Demo}> stennowork: embrace, extend, extinguish 09:46 i.e. https://i.imgur.com/sHxjclm.png 09:46 {Demo}, not anymore 09:46 they did that 09:47 So if you miss a stat for example, you get a relatively nice error. 09:47 <{Demo}> bubbles it's 2019 why are you writing anything new that uses xml 09:47 of course we remember ballmer who called Linux/GPL a cancer 09:48 microsoft went down after they couldn't establish themself on the mobile market and had to revisit their strategies in order to stay alive 09:48 and is now i think the most valuable company? 09:48 {Demo} look at the nice error message 09:48 <{Demo}> satan never changes 09:48 because they really really did it well 09:48 {Demo}, disagree 09:48 And {Demo} it's 2019 so with a decent editor it's super clean/nice to write 09:49 You get tab completion and everything for the custom types 09:49 you should really use json tho :{ 09:49 xml is a thing of the past 09:49 <{Demo}> bubbles that's hard to disagree with but there's definitely a better hipster yaml or json fork option 09:49 thats not a yaml thing 09:49 fun fact: yaml is a superset of json 09:50 <{Demo}> I'm sure someone has some yaml fork where you can do schemas 09:50 I don't care about hipster 09:50 <{Demo}> json sucks, doesn't even have comments, use some variation 09:50 json doesn't have comments 09:50 haha 09:50 And in the end it's no nicer/less-nice to use than xml really 09:50 <{Demo}> there are json variants that are the right choice for this 09:51 'json doesn't have comments' v cute 09:51 <{Demo}> nah xml is terrible and I'd rather die 09:51 I think it's more the tooling is so mature for xml etc 09:51 {Demo} I am going to make you a video 09:53 that json even needs variants just for comments or date shows how broken it is 09:53 at least json has arrays 09:53 unlike xml 09:53 one would think that arrays are important 09:53 Xml does have arrays :hmm: 09:54 xml also has schemas. 09:54 and compared to json they are even usable 09:54 oh yeah if this is about schemas specifically, of course json is not a good choice 09:55 but if its for serialization, its a fine choice 09:55 I love schemas 09:55 I will show you why: 09:55 Give me a min 09:55 how would '{"foo": [1,2,3]}' look in xml? 09:56 [EU] [D]: Dins (Kni-Hum-Fem-Law), 5725 points, 6053 turns, petrified by a chickatrice 09:56 it doesn't matter how it looks like. 09:57 123 e.g. 09:57 it matters how you process ist 09:57 bubbles_nhww, what is 'n' ? 09:57 @?red dragon 09:57 No such monster. 09:57 Your schema defines it 09:57 You what? 09:57 reading or writing XML by hand is a thing of the past 09:57 @v?red dragon 09:57 red dragon (D) | Lvl: 15 | Diff: 20 | Spd: 9 | Res: fire | Confers: fire | MR: 20 | Generates: gehennom dungeons | AC: -1 | Attacks: 6d6 breath fire, 3d8 bite physical, 1d4 claw physical, 1d4 claw physical | Alignment: -4 | Flags: genocidable, carnivore, flies, thick hide, oviparous, seeinvis, infravisible 09:57 ok, so a format that should not be handled manually 09:57 bhaak I agree mostly but this video shows how powerful hand writing with a good schema can be: 09:57 cool stuff 09:57 https://i.imgur.com/emjsjdE.mp4 09:58 document.xpath('/foo/n') -> Array 09:58 Seriously watch that ^ 09:58 And the main main main advantage is when you read it it is wordy but completely unambiguous 09:58 sure, you can do it, and there are good tools nowadays, but I wouldn't usually do it. 09:59 I think for something like defining role/race stats, or item attributes it's fine 09:59 bubbles_nhww: yes for the latter 09:59 Reading > writing imo 10:00 -!- bug_sniper has joined #hardfought 10:00 <{Demo}> it's really cohesive with your editor 10:00 {Demo} that's just vscode 10:00 [US] [D]: Kame (Val-Hum-Fem-Neu), 598 points, 458 turns, killed by a dwarf 10:00 But I think any editor nowadays will suck in the schema to give you that type of editing 10:01 any programmer-notepad-editor I guess 10:01 And you can check on the command line for errors too, i.e. as part of the build process 10:02 Can specify the ranges/types of everything so e.g. you can't typo a "bad" stat value, for example 10:02 bubbles_nhww: I'd go with yaml for stats or attributes 10:02 much less clunky syntax 10:03 Can I do yaml schemas? 10:03 I am not against things 10:03 Can do a yaml<->xml transform most of the time too 10:03 as a vim user allergic to clunky IDEs I don't think much of languages that require the editor to do a lot of legwork for you 10:04 [EU] [D]: Dins (Mon-Hum-Fem-Cha), 473 points, 685 turns, killed by a wand 10:04 -!- stenno\proc has joined #hardfought 10:04 <{Demo}> but aosdict you can get a vim plugin for it! 10:05 happily I don't have any data I want to format as xml 10:06 [US] [D]: Kame (Val-Hum-Fem-Neu), 1524 points, 1493 turns, killed by a wand 10:07 -!- Chris_ANG has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:07 you should get a language server protocol 10:07 plugin 10:09 -!- stenno\proc has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 10:09 Note I was using vim emulation in thav video! 10:09 [hdf-us] [nh363] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu) made his first wish - "blessed rustproof +2 Mjollnir", on T:5366 10:09 But yeah every editor has some lsp or plugin for it 10:09 New thought: typescript! 10:09 how about just writing api docs :thinking: 10:09 stennowork this is for config files 10:09 So at some point they need to be verified 10:09 or "compiled" 10:10 [EU] [D]: thorsb (Val-Hum-Fem-Neu), 5 points, 322 turns, killed by an unsuccessful polymorph 10:11 stennowork: why write documentation that will be ignored as it can't be enforced on the code level? 10:11 !pom 10:11 bouquet: The moon is waxing gibbous; full moon in 4 days. 10:11 why do the job of a machine? 10:11 what do you mean 'will be ignored' 10:11 i am a client 10:11 i want to get data from the backend 10:12 in order to interpret that data, i read the docs 10:12 lol 10:12 that's not how it usually happens 10:12 when i talk to api's thats only what i do 10:12 usually, you do the call and look what comes back. if it looks vaguely okay, you just assume that it always does 10:12 i look at the api, i figure out what i have to send, and then i check the response 10:13 [EU] [D]: Dins (Pri-Hum-Mal-Law), 374 points, 694 turns, killed by a gnome lord 10:13 exactly. you check the response. you don't go to the api doc and check what the response can be (if it documented at all) 10:13 well of course i also check the api 10:13 i check the api first 10:13 api doc first* 10:14 and then you aren't even sure if the doc is correct 10:14 and then expect that the stuff that is returned adheres to the docs 10:14 as the documentation is not necessarily in sync with the code 10:14 [hdf-us] [nh363] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu) rejected atheism by offering a panther corpse on an altar of Moloch, on T:5749 10:14 -!- theRaisse has joined #hardfought 10:14