00:06 [hdf-us] [nh343] UltimateThule (Tou Hum Mal Neu) retrieved the Mine's End luckstone, on T:35942 00:12 [hdf-us] [sp] k2 (Wiz Dwa Mal Neu), 29284 points, T:7433, killed by a nightmare 00:15 <@carlarc> @K2 how dangerous are nightmares? 00:15 <@carlarc> found it a good time to ask 00:15 typical unicorn 00:15 <@carlarc> no differences? 00:16 slight probably. look in src/monst.c for sporkhack if you want a detailed comparison 00:17 <@luxidream> they have a poisonous bite 00:17 <@luxidream> starting pet of chaotic knights 00:17 that sounds rather overpowered 00:17 unless there's a baby nightmare or something 00:17 its not 00:17 <@luxidream> no 00:18 <@luxidream> nothing is overpowered in spork though 00:18 they dont have a lot of hp 00:25 <[Demo]6> they arent gonna save you from dying on astral 00:43 my nightmares are freaking insane these days 00:43 nh is a nice break 00:44 here, take this amulet of restful sleep 00:45 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 0 points, T:7, killed by a water moccasin 00:45 ty :) 00:49 A - a potion of benzodiazepine 00:54 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 435 points, T:1086, killed by a hobgoblin 00:57 -!- rebatela has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:13 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 462 points, T:1273, killed by a dwarf zombie, while frozen by a monster's gaze 01:24 -!- aoei has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:24 -!- aoei has joined #hardfought 02:03 -!- LarienTelrunya has joined #hardfought 02:03 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v LarienTelrunya] by ChanServ 02:03 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 2208 points, T:2769, killed by an invisible chameleon imitating an arch-lich 02:04 <[Demo]6> vanilla should fix that 02:05 <@luxidream> nah if you die to that you are a noob 02:05 <@luxidream> git gud 02:10 <@luxidream> /s 02:10 <@luxidream> if you couldn't tell :p 02:14 -!- tacco\unfoog has joined #hardfought 02:35 <@carlarc> what's the earliest a chameleon can spawn? 02:47 -!- aoei has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 03:23 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 03:38 -!- aoei has joined #hardfought 03:40 -!- raisse has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:46 -!- aeoi has joined #hardfought 03:50 -!- aoei has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 04:09 -!- aoie has joined #hardfought 04:12 -!- aeoi has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 04:25 -!- aeoi has joined #hardfought 04:28 -!- aoie has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:32 -!- stenno has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:35 -!- tacco\unfoog has quit [] 04:55 -!- aoie has joined #hardfought 05:00 -!- aeoi has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 05:14 -!- aoie has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:21 -!- rebatela has joined #hardfought 05:22 pellsson: just read your ascension writeup, great work. But one question you left unanswered: You said that the valley of the dead consumes a different amount of random numbers due to the corpses being from the high-score list, how did you solve that issue for the final, successful run? 05:25 being lucky? 05:25 pellsson: you left out how many attempts you had to save-quit due to desync 05:25 also wtf why the hell do anthole contents depend on the exact second at which the game was started, does that mean if your first anthole has soldier ants then all antholes in the same game have soldier ants? 05:26 probably 05:26 I'm pretty sure this is a bug 05:27 I mean, it's fixed in slex of course, but that's because I use a completely different method for filling them with monsters ;) 05:47 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 05:52 -!- hf_guest_60 has joined #hardfought 05:56 -!- hf_guest_60 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:02 YASI: which square a covetous monster warps to when it warps also depends on the starting time of a game and uses a complex algorithm to make the result depend on the target's x,y coordinates, making same-seed ascension feats almost impossible :D 06:03 i.e. just because the monster will warp to the square southwest of the player in one situation, it won't warp to the square southwest of them if the player were standing on a different tile even if the exact same random number and birthtime values are used, so the run will desync unless the birthtime matches exactly 06:10 -!- raisse has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:19 The anthole bug could be related to the fact that giant ants are monster zero. 06:19 Just a wild guess. 06:22 Something that will definitely cause desyncs, is if the high score files are different. Because the game uses it for ghosts and graves and such. 06:24 yeah but if you play offline to determine the keypresses needed for the "winning run", how do you make it sync with the run on the server? somehow gaining access to their highscore file and pasting that into the local build's directory? :D 06:30 -!- rebatela has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 06:33 This sort of question is why the syscf secret input to the random function is a good idea. 06:37 -!- Ascartars has joined #hardfought 06:38 . 06:39 -!- Ascartars has quit [Quit: Page closed] 06:50 [hdf-us] [slshm] luxor (Val Dop Fem Neu), 144800 points, T:28466, killed by an ettin mummy 07:00 [hdf-us] [slshm] luxor (Val Dop Fem Neu), 139 points, T:333, killed by a boulder 07:12 [hdf-us] [slshm] luxor (Val Dop Fem Neu), 487 points, T:1122, killed by a giant bat 07:12 -!- rebatela has joined #hardfought 07:29 -!- noty has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.2] 07:35 -!- LarienTelrunya has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:36 -!- rebatela has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 07:37 -!- nooodle has joined #hardfought 08:10 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha), 5380 points, T:4433, killed by a bolt of cold 08:15 morning 08:18 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha), 349 points, T:989, taken down by a small mimic 08:22 [hdf-us] [slshm] luxor (Val Dop Fem Neu), 11647 points, T:3875, killed by an ochre jelly 08:24 [hdf-us] [slshm] luxor (Val Dop Fem Neu), 631 points, T:618, killed by a hobbit 08:26 [hdf-us] [slshm] luxor (Val Dop Fem Neu), 114 points, T:70, killed by a falling rock 08:29 -!- stenno has joined #hardfought 08:34 -!- stenno has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 08:37 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:01 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha) chose a runed dagger to be named "Sting", on T:2440 09:02 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha), 3153 points, T:2468, sent to the grave by a gnome lord 09:13 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 09:19 -!- LarienTelrunya has joined #hardfought 09:19 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v LarienTelrunya] by ChanServ 09:23 -!- aoie has joined #hardfought 09:32 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha) chose a runed dagger to be named "Sting", on T:2793 09:36 -!- rebatela has joined #hardfought 09:46 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu) made his first wish - "blessed Orb of Fate", on T:2238 09:47 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 3355 points, T:2261, killed by a crocodile 09:47 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 4 points, T:19, killed by a water moccasin 09:51 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha), 3030 points, T:3842, mowed down by Mr. AlliWar Wickson; the shopkeeper 09:54 -!- aeoi has joined #hardfought 09:54 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 219 points, T:549, killed by a giant rat 09:58 -!- aoie has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 10:01 -!- aeoi has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 10:07 jonadab: OR 10:07 we could use a good csprng 10:08 #define rn2 arc4random_uniform 10:13 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 402 points, T:1078, killed by a hobbit 10:18 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 448 points, T:426, killed by a bolt of cold 10:18 -!- phinxy has quit [Read error: No route to host] 10:24 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 166 points, T:332, killed by a gnome 10:27 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha) had Gae Bulg bestowed upon her by Kos, on T:2409 10:28 [hdf-us] [sp] k2 (Wiz Dwa Mal Neu), 372 points, T:862, killed by a small mimic 10:30 [hdf-us] [sp] k2 (Wiz Dwa Mal Neu), 79 points, T:250, zapped himself with a spell 10:35 would it be too on the nose to have a commit contradicting vanilla's recent green slime stuff, and put "I went another direction" in the commit message 10:35 that would just an appropriate amount of nose 10:38 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha) became literate by reading a book, on T:3687 10:42 [hdf-us] [fh] Athear I (Sergio) (Pri Hum Mal Law), 23028 points, T:1233, killed by a gnomish wizard's force bolt 10:59 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha) chose a runed dagger to be named "Sting", on T:5038 11:07 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha), 3494 points, T:5084, overpowered by a dwarf 11:07 LarienTelrunya: Uhm, as far as we could tell, it only mattered if there was a record file or not 11:10 Where is the afforementioned writeup, anyway? 11:10 bhaak: i think we only did like ~10 attempts or so on NAO before it work. most desyncs could be address locally 11:10 pellsson: ah I see, so once you had one locally it would be synced :) 11:11 yeah, it as like 1 am local time :) 11:11 so once we we understood that "ah, having a record file makes it sync with the local vanilla game" 11:11 we tried it on NAO and he ascended, could be that there is more to it and we got super lucky 11:11 she* 11:12 I want to read about this too >.< 11:12 oh its on the nethack reddit 11:12 thanks 11:16 pellsson: that's a reasonable number of attempts 11:16 not too bad. 11:17 not like the 12 conducts attempts where they started and immediately quit 200k games to get the right starting conditions :-) 11:17 Lol TNNT being over still pinned on reddit 11:17 it's still over, isn't it? :-} 11:18 would be fun to have her ascend all conducts 11:19 feels a bit pointless at this stage... but still, a bit cool 11:19 like all in one game that is 11:19 pellsson: Wishless might need a bit more development effort :-) 11:19 not really though 11:20 dlvl2 is a perfectly good fountain substitute 11:20 :) 11:20 although assuming ALL conducts, items wont matter too much 11:21 get to dlvl8, dog -> archon & have a magic whistle...? some purple worms too i guess 11:21 then alot of bruteforce 11:22 would need a harp for more pets 11:22 if feel like hungerless pacifists are rare :) 11:22 eh, foodless 11:29 I thought this might me an interesting approach for testing 11:30 <[Demo]6> id like to see the rng abuse needed to ascend without wishes :P 11:31 <[Demo]6> in that fast ascension situation 11:32 i dont think it would be that much worse? definately harder and require better bot code, but not soooo much worse? maybe it is :) 11:33 <[Demo]6> it would be interesting to see what items you go for and what items you dont 11:34 <[Demo]6> cause with wishing you can be pretty inefficient with the number of items you use 11:35 <[Demo]6> but every item you need to spawn on a dlvl increases the amount of rng searching by like, idk exponentially? 11:35 i think death-drops are created as you kill something 11:35 dont quote me on that though :) 11:35 pellsson: They are. 11:36 mmm, could force having a lot of spawns then, and kill them as you enter a level 11:36 rather than relying on what levels are created on the level 11:36 might be faster? 11:36 <[Demo]6> yeah death drops could work a lot better 11:36 not sure 11:36 but i mean, if its an ALL conduct speedrun 11:37 <[Demo]6> true 11:37 you only really need 15b!oGL 11:37 and... ~50c!oGL? 11:37 magic whistle and a harp 11:37 if it's possible to do such a speedrun ascension for vanilla, is it also possible to do one for slex? *bundlebundlebundle* ;) 11:38 LarienTelrunya: Ha, I thought you'd already have deployed a counter-patch 11:38 uhh no, I wanted to implement a CSPRNG but it made the game unbearably laggy 11:39 LarienTelrunya: Sure, but if the game routinely uses a number of random numbers that depends on the state of the record file, the corpus of bones files, etc... 11:42 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu) polymorphed his first object, on T:4995 11:43 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu) performed his first genocide (class L), on T:5046 11:44 from experience, when we realized that VoD, of course, had to depend on the record stuff we were pretty sad :) 11:45 pellsson: Mmm, so I reckon if a variant scatters that stuff everywhere - it doesn't even have to _do_ anything - it's going to make your attack very hard. 11:46 i would give up for sure 11:46 they seem to want a proper fix though that is garantueed to work 11:46 and the idea that was raised to encrypt the random value is absolutely brilliant 11:46 oh, I guess slex then actually automatically thwarts the run in many cases, because its graveyards also get filled with actual player monsters directly from the high-score file, depending on the roles of late players, and which get different amounts of randomized equipment depending on class :D 11:47 as for slex, understanding the game enough to start contemplating a bot is obsticle enough :) 11:47 LarienTelrunya: What that doesn't thwart is bones griefing, though. Alas. 11:47 so unless the high-score files are exactly the same offline and online, it would most probably result in different player monsters being spawned and thus a different # of random numbers being used 11:48 Pinkbeast: how would you even thwart bones griefing? I'm not sure if that can be achieved by using some automated way without it also discarding legit-but-still-dangerous bones 11:49 LarienTelrunya: I only want to thwart bones griefing by a pellsson attack, because it could be near-automated and utterly horrible. 11:49 At least for normal bones griefing the griefer has to play the game a bit to do it. ;-/ 11:51 oh, hmm yeah I guess the only answer to that (if it were to happen) would probably be the server administrator banning whatever bot account is being used (and then the botter would make a new one, so that's not really a solution either) 11:51 ... or to do what I suggested 11:53 bones griefing == creating mean bones deliberately? 11:53 If the state of D:1 depends on the contents of bones files, a pellsson attacker can't even do _anything_, I think? 11:53 pellsson: Yes, 11:54 ... and yes, it is not (alas) a purely hypothetical threat 11:54 it would be very hard yeah, but it is essentially the same as just modifying the rnd() function locally 11:55 <[Demo]6> wonder how long it would take to get a seed db generated on 128 threads of ~10 year old xeons 11:56 quick 11:56 assuming they have cores enough for 128 threads to make sense 11:57 <[Demo]6> are we talking only a few hours or only a few days or only a few weeks? 11:57 a day i'd say 11:57 depending of course on the logic by which you index the seeds and create the next game 11:57 we stupidly used md5 11:57 <[Demo]6> did you have any collisions? 11:57 could have used as well used like crc32 or something, 1/4 of the size and a lot faster 11:58 no, but it wouldnt have mattered 11:58 <[Demo]6> what if you happened to hit a collision situation with a start inventory? 11:58 just start all games and see which one it is (with your human eyes) 11:58 <[Demo]6> using human eyes sucks 11:58 if you get like hundreds of collisions it is of course bad though :) 11:59 hehe yeah, if you dont want human eyes you need to make it free of collision 12:00 but md5 collide for a set that small 12:00 put the game and all its files in ram too 12:01 saves alot 12:01 md5 wont* collide, man i cant type today <.< 12:03 <[Demo]6> would there be any advantage keeping db in ram until the end? 12:05 i guess but if you use md5 is 16+4 bytes / record or ~90 gig 12:05 <[Demo]6> yeah thats not a problem 12:06 then just sort it by hash, and binary search it :) 12:09 <[Demo]6> how do you fingerprint each game from the bots view? surely, theres plenty of seeds that make the same tourist inventory? do you also look at the starting room? 12:09 just the inventory 12:09 -!- raisse has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:09 and no, they all seem unique (we didnt actually check for collisions, but we've never seen one in the games we've played) 12:10 <[Demo]6> what order of magnitude of games have you played? 12:10 hehe... 50 or so? :) 12:10 100? 12:10 not sure 12:10 where we looked up the hash 12:10 <[Demo]6> ok so not like 10000 or something 12:10 no 12:10 <[Demo]6> thats still good enough 12:11 so the probability is like... 1/1000 gold; 1/10(?) darts, 1/num_food 6x, 1/possible_mark_charges, and stats 12:12 could calculate that and see how many colliding inventories there should be 12:12 im sure we did at some point, but i have no recollection of the result 12:13 eh, not marker charges, camera charges 12:15 also, eggs and tins add a lot of uniqueness 12:16 <[Demo]6> oh true 12:16 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 7809 points, T:6250, killed by an owlbear 12:18 <[Demo]6> what amount of parsing goes into pulling the inventory text? 12:19 just a pile of regex 12:19 <[Demo]6> I assume you are parsing out that block and just hashing it and storing it with the actual seed 12:19 yeah, pythonhack that had the stuff onames.h included in it 12:21 <[Demo]6> what? 12:21 i seem to omit every other word today... having a tiny stroke i think :) 12:21 <[Demo]6> not familiar with pythonhack 12:21 oh 12:21 a pythonhack is a hack written in python :) 12:22 <[Demo]6> you facilitated the bruteforce in python? 12:22 no just the stuff to go from NAO -> seed 12:22 <[Demo]6> ah 12:51 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha) had Stormbringer bestowed upon her by Kos, on T:5602 13:13 [hdf-us] [nh362] Bartlem (Pri Hum Fem Cha) became literate by reading a scroll, on T:3282 13:14 [hdf-us] [nh362] Bartlem (Pri Hum Fem Cha) rejected atheism with a prayer, on T:3432 13:18 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha), 9960 points, T:6477, done in by a leocrotta 13:20 [hdf-us] [un] hothraxxa (Hea Gno Mal Neu), 3493 points, T:8052, killed by a snow ant 13:22 -!- phinxy has joined #hardfought 13:24 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 2660 points, T:5732, killed by a winter wolf 13:24 <@Winsalot> LarienTelrunya: hey. I am playing as wisp, who was bitten by some trash wereanimal 13:24 @Winsalot: alright one moment, I'll fire up my terminal :) 13:24 <@Winsalot> So when I turned I did #youpoly 13:25 <@Winsalot> and turned into a fuckin red baby dragon 13:25 <@Winsalot> how and why? 13:25 ah you're a flame mage, they have that special polymorphing ability 13:25 <@Winsalot> oh 13:25 <@Winsalot> will I grow up into adult dragon someday? 13:26 whenever you #youpoly you can decide whether you want to do the dragon transformation ritual 13:26 -!- tacco\unfoog has joined #hardfought 13:26 IIRC at a certain experience level the polymorph will be a full-grown dragon 13:26 <@Winsalot> ok, nice 13:27 <[Demo]6> but also if you are a doppleganger it fucks you over and you cant free poly 13:27 <[Demo]6> and HAVE to become a dragon 13:27 <@Winsalot> if I have ring of poly control, can I return from my weredog from back to normal at will? 13:27 <[Demo]6> why? because slashem SUCKS 13:27 <@Winsalot> 😃 13:28 XL 13 seems to be the requirement for the full dragon form 13:28 not sure what happens if you try to youpoly while in dog form 13:28 <[Demo]6> amy does slex fix doppleganger foomages? 13:28 but poly control will probably ask you "Transform into a weredog?" if you're about to transform 13:28 [Demo]6: of course it does! 13:28 <[Demo]6> does it make you angry too? 13:29 heh, it's annoying to be sure, but I didn't play the doppelganger often in regular slashem 13:29 <[Demo]6> ugh its the most annoying 13:29 <[Demo]6> the moment you hit xlvl 7 you are screwed 13:30 yeah the slashem dev team didn't think of everything, but I've fixed far worse slashem bugs in slex, like the infamous hallucination savegame-corrupting segfault panic :D 13:30 <[Demo]6> how does that one work again? 13:30 -!- rebatela has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:31 that happens because for the hallucinated appearances of items, the game makes actual items as dummy objects, and if they are containers, their contents don't get cleaned up correctly 13:31 so if such a container contains an egg or other timed object, the object isn't removed correctly and the timer persists, now pointing to a nonexistant object, and then the game blows up if you save, change levels, or play long enough for the timer to fire. 13:31 <[Demo]6> oh, obj->where is rip? 13:32 it's fixed in hardfought-slashem though 13:32 <[Demo]6> is that the panic it hits? 13:32 <@Tone> pellsson: Was reading backscroll - Pacifists don't get random death drops 13:32 uhh don't remember, in slex there was a time when we had the additional problem that it would segfault during the panic because of an error in the panic message wording :P 13:32 <[Demo]6> panic occurs in obj_is_local() Amy? 13:33 oh god 13:33 don't remind me of that goddamn function... yeah that's it 13:33 <[Demo]6> ok so like the dnh bug 13:33 <[Demo]6> that still isnt tracked down yet 13:33 <[Demo]6> but its present in dnh, ndnh, and dnhslex 13:33 "obj_is_local" is on my red list of strings I never want to read again, together with "cant find o_id" and "cant find m_id" 13:33 <[Demo]6> the worst dnh bug is the level destruction bug 13:34 <[Demo]6> where level files end up getting deleted 13:34 [Demo]6: how does dnethack hallu work? does it create actual objects for the hallucinated appearances? 13:34 <[Demo]6> which is present in dnh and dnhslex and possibly? in ndnh but i havent seen it happen in ndnh but its uber rare 13:34 i.e. does the obj_is_local bug strike after the player was hallucinating? 13:34 <[Demo]6> no its not caused by hallu 13:34 <[Demo]6> tangles? i think? got it to trigger on hdf he might know more 13:34 <@Tone> pellsson: With all conducts considered, I don't think there are many means of random item generation. Level generation and alchemy come to mind, and then there are offensive/defensive monster items. 13:34 also level destruction bug ("savegame error" as I call it) sounds very bad 13:34 <[Demo]6> and sometimes it happens in ndnh in the archipelago 13:35 <[Demo]6> yes it is insanely bad 13:35 <[Demo]6> and all the reports of it happening that ive heard of its happened around the quest 13:35 does the savegame error happen in regular dnethack too? 13:35 <[Demo]6> "which is present in dnh and dnhslex and possibly? in ndnh but i havent seen it happen in ndnh but its uber rare" 13:36 since I'm not Chris, I also don't know about all the changes he might have made to the quest, with racial subquests and stuff 13:36 <[Demo]6> yes it might be something caused by 3.16.0 13:36 <[Demo]6> so it might not be in ndnh 13:36 <[Demo]6> well its weird that it hasnt happened since 3.16.0 came out 13:36 it would probably help to track down whether it's actually caused by a segfault during saving the game 13:36 because that's what the savegame error in slex was 13:36 <[Demo]6> the problem is replication 13:37 it would result in a partial savegame with level files still around, and if the player then uses autorecover on the server, a savegame with missing level files results 13:37 -!- rebatela has joined #hardfought 13:37 -!- pellsson has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:42 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 381 points, T:774, killed by a giant bat 13:44 <[Demo]6> hmm ndnh seems to have a segfault that happens sometimes when you pick a random character role (so some certain char combo causes it) where it crashes in adjabil 13:44 integer overflow? :P 13:44 get a backtrace! :D 13:44 <[Demo]6> the backtrace isnt very useful 13:45 <[Demo]6> crashes on line if (!abil || !abil->ability) { 13:46 huh 13:46 <[Demo]6> i cant remember if ive touched attrib.c recently 13:47 well you could try all possible role/race combos manually and test whether one of those causes it :) 13:47 -!- pellsson has joined #hardfought 13:48 <[Demo]6> uh oh, the last commit that affected attrib.c is a cherrypick from upstream 13:49 <[Demo]6> i swear i introduce as many bugs as i fix pulling stuff from upstream jesus christ 13:50 <[Demo]6> "Oh this looks like a cool change that definitely won't break anything" 13:54 <[Demo]6> oh turns out nero fixed it already and i didnt notice 13:55 what was the cause? 13:56 <[Demo]6> chris added some special casing for special noble races getting extra role abilities 13:56 <[Demo]6> but didnt handle the case where they got none 13:56 ah 13:59 -!- ProzacElf has joined #hardfought 14:03 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:04 [hdf-us] [un] hothraxxa (Hea Gno Fem Neu), 448 points, T:2283, killed by a boiling potion 14:04 fucking early magic traps 14:05 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 1305 points, T:1758, killed by a giant bat 14:09 [hdf-us] [nh362] Bartlem (Pri Hum Fem Cha), 3632 points, T:6425, killed by a fire ant 14:12 [hdf-us] [slshm] Demo3 (Nec Dop Fem Cha), 231 points, T:88, killed by a fox 14:13 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu) murdered Catnip, his faithful kitten, on T:153 14:16 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu) performed his first genocide (cockatrice), on T:652 14:29 [hdf-us] [slshm] Demo3 (Nec Dop Fem Cha), 8122 points, T:1785, killed by a fire elemental of Zugguthobal 14:30 [Demo]6: working on a mod? 14:31 [hdf-us] [slshm] Demo3 (Nec Dop Fem Cha), 217 points, T:343, killed by an orcish spear 14:32 <[Demo]6> depends what you mean by that 14:33 a modified version of nethack 14:33 <[Demo]6> yeah a fork of a fork 14:33 many of us are variant developers, I'm one too :) 14:34 cool :) 14:34 LarienTelrunya: which variant? 14:34 pellsson: slex, dnhslex and bigslex (however, bigslex is basically just slex with bigger dungeon levels) :) 14:34 LarienTelrunya: sick :o 14:35 <[Demo]6> in the head 14:36 [hdf-us] [nh362] Bartlem (Pri Hum Fem Cha), 1314 points, T:2316, killed by a housecat 14:36 i really should try slex on of these days, i hear its fun 14:37 yes!!! it definitely is :) play slex! *bundlebundlebundle* 14:37 <@Winsalot> "FUN" 14:37 actually, think i started a game a while back :o 14:37 pellsson: on which server do you usually play? 14:37 slex is slashem extended right? or am i making a fool of myself? :) 14:38 NAO exclusively, aside from the slex game 14:38 pellsson: this channel has the developer of every actively played variant except grunthack 14:38 aosdict: oh i had no idea 14:38 <[Demo]6> and dyna 14:38 <[Demo]6> we dont have the dyna dude 14:38 no, tungtn is here 14:38 <[Demo]6> i thought he died or something 14:38 you're thinking of nitrohack? 14:38 <[Demo]6> oh yeah thats it 14:38 nitro isn't actively played 14:39 superseded by nh4 14:39 i wrote a nethack variant too :) 14:39 grunt is also no longer active in DCSS AFAIK. don't know what he's up to 14:39 pellsson: yeah slex is short for slashem extended 14:39 !who 14:39 LarienTelrunya: [hdf-us] Demo3 [slshm] Karnac [nh362] oh6 [nh362] hothraxxa [un] Noah [spl] | [hdf-eu] winsalot [slex] | [hdf-au] No current players 14:39 bhaak: I was going to say "oh I forgot about dyna" but your answer is better :D 14:40 LarienTelrunya: aight cool, then i do have a game going somewhere... i think 14:40 : 14:40 ) 14:41 <@luxidream> tungtn is here? 14:41 [hdf-us] [nh362] Karnac (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 3065 points, T:3162, killed by a white unicorn 14:42 yes, though I can't recall ever seeing him say anything 14:42 pellsson: you're not like sgrunt's long lost brother or something are you? 14:43 aosdict: no brothers to my knowledge :) 14:49 slex sure is colorful :) 14:50 ahem, the term is "fleecy" :P 14:50 yeah I love "fleecy" colors ♥ 14:56 [hdf-us] [spl] Noah (Rog Inf Fem Cha), 1655 points, T:2596, killed by a crossbow bolt 15:00 [hdf-us] [slshm] Demo3 (Nec Dop Fem Cha), 12223 points, T:3326, poisoned by a couatl 15:00 <[Demo]6> aaaaaaa poison instadeath 15:09 pellsson: you want status/menucolors? here's my config file: https://eu.hardfought.org/userdata/A/AmyBSOD/slex/AmyBSOD.slexrc :) 15:10 -!- ProzacElf has joined #hardfought 15:11 omg yes :) 15:11 <@carlarc> if they're not going to make my inventory a rainbow i'm going to be disappointed 15:11 is minetown normally enraged by default? :o 15:12 <@carlarc> maybe it was a bones file? 15:12 <@carlarc> they're not 15:12 <@carlarc> it could be conflict 15:12 pellsson: no, but you used a cursed tin whistle, which angered the watch 15:12 aaah 15:13 aaah and chaotic :) 15:13 uncommon as priest 15:13 now i understand what is going on ;) 15:13 eh, tourist* 15:13 yeah at least the murder penalties will be minimal :) 15:16 btw pellsson, do you know about in-game item information? you can hit an item's corresponding letter in normal inventory view to get a description (which will give more info if the item is identified) :) 15:19 oooh awesome! 15:19 thanks 15:19 is angry chaotic god equally annoying in slex? :) 15:19 it's even more annoying than in vanilla; hopefully Offler was displeased because you had negative luck/alignment (maybe from killing the watch) as opposed to you praying too often, because then he won't actually be angry at you now 15:24 oh yeah, first time i prayed when it failed 15:24 you saying he could theoretically be happy now? 15:25 yes, but your alignment might still be negative unless you killed a bunch of monsters since the watch incident 15:26 ye alignment should be absolutely fine by now 15:26 assuming thats similar to nethack 15:27 well the murder penalty reduces your alignment by more, but you killed a lot of gnomes and stuff so it might be positive again now 15:27 YANI: Whenever mkobj generates a corpse, check in_mklev; if in mklev, age the corpse to where it's not fresh. 15:31 don't waste the scrolls of cure, they're for curing sickness, petrification and sliming 15:31 hehe figured they were for hp, but i figured :) 15:31 ...after reading 15:32 yeah for hp there's the scrolls of (extra) healing 15:32 also I guess that watch captain is tough due to his plate mail, which gives him lots of AC 15:34 pellsson: you can teleport over short distances via the scrolls of phase door 15:35 <@kamkon-2> Make big money > http://discordbetfaq.whatsappx.com 15:37 <@carlarc> fuuucking hell 15:37 @mod ? 15:38 <@mtf> thanks guys 15:38 <@mtf> we're going to be testing some new initiates to stop the bot invasion this weekned 15:38 <@mtf> so hopefully this insanity will end soon 15:38 <[Demo]6> man i dont want to make big money, i want sex dating 15:38 <[Demo]6> can we get the bot that spams that back? 15:39 hi @mtf 15:39 <@mtf> hahah demo 15:39 <@mtf> what's up fiq 😄 15:39 <@mtf> good to see ya 15:39 good to see you too 15:39 <@Audrey 💝> hi i'm here too! 15:39 I saw that you streamed cogmind earlier 15:40 how did it go 15:40 <@mtf> I did 😃 Concluded a super spoiler run, but without the ultimate victory (got a basic win instead, disappointing), and then I failed a couple flight runs to wrap up the stream for last night xD 15:40 I see 15:40 sounds like fun either way 15:40 <@mtf> the concluded run was a hell of a lot of fun though 15:41 <@mtf> might be one of the best roguelike runs I've ever had enjoymentwise 15:41 nice 15:41 <@mtf> should stop by and say hi sometime 😛 What've you been up to these days? 15:41 :P 15:42 my single-minded focus atm is on romhack development 15:42 <@mtf> ooooh 15:42 <@mtf> which rom are we hacking? 15:43 <@mtf> I recall you mentioning modding pokemon in the past 15:43 pokemon 15:43 yeah 15:43 the older games have disassembly projects nowdays 15:43 <@mtf> nice 😛 what are you building, a randomizer or something? 15:43 <@mtf> oh that's useful 15:43 so you get as close to the original source code you possibly could that way 15:43 making modding especially easy 15:43 <@mtf> yea having the debug symbols helps 15:44 last year (as in 2017), I contributed to a romhack of crystal called polished crystal, mostly contributing to its battle engine 15:44 then I burnt out, refocused on NetHack dev 15:44 same thing now pretty much 15:45 also been working on porting the Prism code optimizations to make the game run at 60fps 15:45 (Prism was a romhack of crystal that got some attention some years ago due to a C&D and a youtube trailer that went viral) 15:45 <@mtf> dude, that's pretty sweet 15:46 <@mtf> upgraded battle engine you say? 15:46 yes 15:46 with features of later generations 15:46 <@mtf> in what ways is it different? (this may be a very broad question haha) 15:46 the most major one probably being abilities 15:46 <@mtf> ahhh I see 15:46 not sure how much you know about pokemon 15:47 <@mtf> I've played red, blue, yellow, silver, and gold 15:47 <@mtf> so... a bit 😛 15:47 ahh 15:47 at some point (during what is commonly referred to as the 3rd generation of pokemon games -- ruby, sapphire, fire red, leaf green, emerald), gamefreak implemented abilities for pokémon 15:47 a change that was about as huge as the held item feature of GSC 15:48 porting that to Crystal took a lot 15:48 <@mtf> how are these different than the abilities that pokemon could use on the world map? like cut, surf, or fly? 15:48 abilities are things specific to each pokémon, which does stuff like, for example, lower the foe's Attack by 1 stage when you send the pokémon in 15:49 <@mtf> ohhhh 15:49 <@mtf> these are more like passive abilities yea? 15:50 a list of ability descriptions of the ones I implemented, to give you an idea of what abiliteis actually are: https://github.com/Rangi42/polishedcrystal/blob/master/data/abilities.asm#L403 15:50 wait, is crystal gen 2 15:50 yes 15:50 ahhh 15:51 yeah, was going to say, pretty sure gen 3 had held items 15:51 gen 2 as well 15:51 <@mtf> "reflects status changing moves" seems reaaaaaal good 15:51 as that's the only one I played extensively 15:51 I was comparing held items because @mtf apparently played silver/gold 15:51 which had held items 15:51 and red/blue/yellow 15:51 which didn't 15:51 <@mtf> yea 15:51 <@mtf> I remember the held items 15:51 to give @mtf an idea of the work required to add abilities 15:52 well, none of the abilities in generation 3 seemed that overpowered 15:52 (which was a similarly big feature) 15:52 <@mtf> this sounds like a fun 15:52 <@mtf> is polished crystal playable yet? I'm guessing yes 15:52 It is, yes 15:52 It's basically crystal++ 15:52 So it's entirely playable, has various new areas, new features, etc 15:53 aosdict: Shadow Tag 15:53 besides that, no, abilities aren't really overpowered 15:53 <@mtf> hmm maybe I should give it a shot 15:53 <@mtf> haven't played a pokemon game in years 15:54 there are 2 branches, master which is mainline, and optimizations, which is 60fps but which may have some issues arising from that (which is why it isn't merged) 15:55 <@mtf> is 60fps really worth pursuing for this type of game? 15:56 what does shadow tag do again 15:56 prevents the opponent from switching out 15:57 @mtf it's nice, but the best part IMO isn't the 60fps itself 15:57 but the assorted performance gains elsewhere 15:57 <@mtf> ahhh 15:57 in menus, etc 15:57 <@mtf> all the slow stuff moves that much faster eh 15:57