00:03 -!- Chris_ANG has joined #hardfought 00:04 [hdf-us] [xnh] k2 (Arc Dwa Mal Law) polymorphed his first object, on T:9451 00:05 [hdf-us] [fh] arhimen (ahrimen) (Val Dwa Fem Law), 53066 points, T:6791, killed by a leocrotta, while frozen by a potion 00:09 congrats Anerag 00:09 Thanks, xNetHack is pretty cool 00:10 Nice one Anerag, and glad you liked it 00:10 [hdf-us] [nh4] ahrimen (Val Dwa Fem Law), 36522 points, T:2579, quit 00:21 -!- a_boudelia has joined #hardfought 00:21 -!- Chris_ANG has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:21 -!- a_boudelia has quit [Client Quit] 00:21 -!- a_boudelia has joined #hardfought 00:22 I think my favorite thing about xnh is the spell failure rework 00:34 [hdf-us] [dnh] monstergrin (Ana Elf Fem Cha), 96 points, T:196, killed by a water demon 00:35 -!- a_boudelia has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.1] 00:35 -!- stenno\ito has joined #hardfought 00:37 -!- raisse\splat has joined #hardfought 00:37 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse\splat] by ChanServ 00:40 !who 00:40 Pavel\ito: [hdf-us] aosdictj [fh] 00:40 Pavel\ito: [hdf-eu] No current players 00:40 Pavel\ito: [hdf-au] Grasshopper [nh361] 00:41 -!- Pavel\ito is now known as PavelB 00:41 -!- stenno\ito has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:41 -!- noty has joined #hardfought 00:44 why can't I push boulders into a space where a giant is standing 00:44 Be the change you want to see in this world 00:45 .oO(I've learned more about C by unsuccessfully trying to figure out how NetHack works than anything else) 00:46 I'm busy blatantly violating the fiqhack principle of obsoleting forgotten spells 00:47 What's that? 00:48 [hdf-us] [nh343] Raisse (Wiz Orc Fem Cha), 21058 points, T:9446, killed by a boiling potion 00:53 I'm too paranoid about resources and timing on the Planes to use anything except confused gold detection, and I don't want to waste four extra scrolls on cursed confuse monster. So I'm abusing slow digestion to forget my first spell after 60k turns. 00:55 -!- Chris_ANG has joined #hardfought 01:39 [hdf-us] [4k] Syl (Silver2195) (Wiz Syl Fem Neu) wished for "magic marker", on T:18972 01:46 -!- AmyBSOD\srn has joined #hardfought 01:54 [hdf-us] [4k] Syl (Silver2195) (Wiz Syl Fem Neu) entered the Sokoban zoo, on T:20014 01:55 -!- AmyBSOD\srn has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:03 [hdf-us] [dnh] lapis (Ana Dro Fem Cha), 5396 points, T:1160, killed by a bolt of lightning 02:08 -!- raisse\splat has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:13 [hdf-us] [dnh] lapis (Ana Dro Fem Cha) entered Minetown for the first time, on T:929 03:23 -!- Chris_ANG has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:27 -!- AmyBSOD\srn has joined #hardfought 03:51 <@luxidream> elenmirie: how do you get such long names in NH4?? 04:08 -!- raisse\splat has joined #hardfought 04:08 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse\splat] by ChanServ 04:32 -!- Grasshopper has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:41 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:41 -!- Tariru has joined #hardfought 04:47 -!- zid has quit [] 04:47 -!- ProzacElf has joined #hardfought 04:56 -!- raisse\splat has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:01 -!- zid has joined #hardfought 06:20 -!- hothraxxa has quit [Quit: Page closed] 06:32 -!- hothraxxa has joined #hardfought 06:32 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v hothraxxa] by ChanServ 06:36 Great, a fountain wish, I finally got the saddle I need to finish this buggy game. 06:39 huh? dyna has bugs where you can't progress if you're not riding?! 06:42 <[Demo][srn]> yes 06:42 <[Demo][srn]> where asmos breaks the valley 06:42 <[Demo][srn]> and you have to branchport skip 06:42 <[Demo][srn]> you have to counter the bug with another bug 07:08 how does that bug even strike? in my dyna game I didn't encounter it 07:10 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:16 [hdf-us] [spl] hothraxxa (Val Hum Fem Law) genocided class L, on T:20051 07:18 nice medusa level. random magic marker 0:87 and a random wand of death 07:19 -!- Tariru_ has joined #hardfought 07:21 [hdf-us] [spl] hothraxxa (Val Hum Fem Law) killed Medusa, on T:20080 07:21 -!- Tariru has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:26 -!- noty has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.0.1] 07:49 [hdf-us] [nh343] davebees (Val Hum Fem Neu), 1613 points, T:924, quit 07:54 [hdf-us] [nh361] Eleven (Hea Hum Mal Neu) entered the Planes, on T:73306 07:54 [hdf-us] [nh361] Eleven (Hea Hum Mal Neu) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:73307 08:13 -!- raisse\splat has joined #hardfought 08:13 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse\splat] by ChanServ 08:29 [hdf-us] [nh361] Eleven (Hea Hum Mal Neu) killed Death, on T:73597 08:33 -!- AmyBSOD\srn has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:40 [hdf-us] [nh343] dgoddard (Wiz Hum Mal Neu), 13685 points, T:5255, killed by an ogre lord 08:50 [hdf-us] [nh343] dgoddard (Wiz Hum Mal Neu), 2034 points, T:2897, poisoned by a little dart 08:59 -!- MiseryMyra has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 09:07 [hdf-us] [nh343] Raisse (Wiz Orc Fem Cha), 37768 points, T:21704, killed by a troll 09:07 grr Ishould have killed with my rubber chicken 09:07 which I'd only picked up to keep thesoldiers from doing that 09:09 I read that as "killed by a scroll" 09:09 which I guess... paper golem? 09:10 I killed so many paper golems with that char that I could have opened a stationery shop. 09:18 @d?hellcat 09:18 No such monster. 09:26 -!- MiseryMyra has joined #hardfought 09:28 raisse\splat: I saw a suggestion while browsing RGRN that if you're polyselfed into a paper golem, the body_parts for FINGER and TOE become "endpapers" :D 09:29 Are paper golems vertebrates? 09:32 -!- Tangles_ has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 09:34 -!- Tangles has joined #hardfought 09:34 -!- mode/#hardfought [+o Tangles] by ChanServ 09:37 zid: Clearly they are, because they have a spine. :D 09:45 -!- elenmirie\splat has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:47 -!- AmyBSOD\srn has joined #hardfought 09:58 wooooooooooooohooooooooooooooo congratulations Tariru_ on doing the impossible!!! 09:58 Thanks Amy. 09:59 all hail the king of the world ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ 09:59 That valley crash bug was really annoying. 09:59 you had to become neutral to circumvent it? 09:59 are you really human? 10:00 Tariru just ascended, so they're a demigod, of course 10:00 a mere demigod? not bloody likely 10:00 <[Demo][srn]> Wait is he kotw now? 10:00 not only kotw, he streaked it 10:00 king of the world with bells on! 10:01 also whoever said that you get kotw with one variant unascended must have lied :P 10:01 <[Demo][srn]> jesus how 10:01 bhaak: new trophy suggestion: king of the world with bells on :D 10:01 <[Demo][srn]> how? 10:02 http://puu.sh/ANskg/93b12e46bc.png 10:02 Good grief 10:05 NetHack is too easy, clearly 10:06 [hdf-us] [nh361] IceBox (Val Hum Fem Law) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:38910 10:07 <@Tone\ootc> 'grats Tariru 😄 10:07 [hdf-us] [nh361] IceBox (Val Hum Fem Law) acquired the Book of the Dead, on T:38944 10:07 But, yeah, that's absolutely bananas. Congrats, Tariru 10:07 Habemus Regem! 10:08 I like the clarification on "ascended (with the Amulet)" 10:08 Well done, Tariru. Now you must face your final test... Nethack 1.3d :) 10:08 grats Tariru_ 10:08 clearly we need to make five new variants before next junethack to make it more of a challenge next time 10:08 aosdict\ito: No, just one. The Evil Variant. 10:08 aosdict\ito: Well, even Tariru needed almost full month. 10:08 evilhack! the variant that K2 wants to make! :D 10:08 -!- Chris_ANG has joined #hardfought 10:09 AmyBSOD\srn: let's see K2 show some coding chops, then I'll believe it's happening 10:09 Junethack: Achievement "Sightseeing Tour" unlocked by Tariru! 10:09 Junethack: Achievement "Anti-Stoner" unlocked by Tariru! 10:09 Junethack: Achievement "Globetrotter" unlocked by Tariru! 10:09 Junethack: Achievement "King of the World" unlocked by Tariru! 10:09 Junethack: Tariru ascended a game of DynaHack on eu.hardfought.org! 10:09 i dont have coding chops 10:09 i do have pure awesome chops though 10:09 and bowstaff skills 10:10 congrats Tariru_ !! 10:13 [hdf-us] [nh361] hypnotist (Bar Hum Fem Neu) acquired the luckstone from Mines' End, on T:14951 10:14 Tariru_: congrats you insane being 10:15 has there ever been a king of the world before? 10:16 Pretty sure there was. 10:16 stth I guess. 10:16 not streaked though 10:16 stenno? 10:16 yeah, certainly stth 10:17 bhaak: Why there is not Trophy Scoreboard in the past years? 10:17 streaked including slex 10:17 bhaak: I mean this page (https://junethack.net/trophy_scoreboard), but for past years. 10:17 Oh, I found it. 10:18 Yes, stth had KotW in 2014. 10:19 But there were much less variants. 10:19 (only 7, compared to 13 today). 10:19 stth had it from 2012 to 2014 10:19 no slex 10:19 in 2015 it was probably impossible to get because of the bugvariant slashthem :P 10:19 Back than even loser like me could get prince of the world :) 10:20 i'm betting no streak 10:20 AmyBSOD\srn: Tariru ascended SLASHTHEM> 10:20 AmyBSOD\srn: I have watched his game. 10:20 without getting a dumplog crash at the end? 10:20 No. 10:20 It crashed. 10:21 But that's the devs fault, not Tarirus. 10:21 so it wouldn't have counted for junethack 10:21 True. 10:21 rip 10:21 yeah; he never bothered fixing it and has disappeared off the face of the earth :( 10:21 But he didn't ascend only because it was so buggy as to be impossible. 10:21 yes, I count it as an ascension of course, but for junethack purposes slashthem was unascendable 10:22 Chris_ANG: Tangle's Ana game crashed has he was leaving the quest. dNetHack is buggy! 10:25 aosdict\ito: maybe I should make forgotten spells only stun? :P 10:26 <@Tone\ootc> haha 10:27 so long as you do it after junethack, that's actually a sensible change 10:27 sure, I don't do feature changes in junethack 10:27 [hdf-us] [nh361] Xzight (Val Dwa Fem Law) had Excalibur thrown at her by some watery tart, on T:3223 10:27 Noted? 10:28 AmyBSOD\srn: slth was removed from junethack 10:28 yeah, the only actual way a player would get a forgotten spell in fiqhack now is if they're trying to abuse it like I'm doing 10:28 FIQ: yes I know, but in 2015 it was part of the tournament 10:28 so what casting a forgotten spell actually does is much less significant 10:28 for legit non-abusing game 10:29 ames 10:29 games 10:29 AmyBSOD\srn: it was removed mid-tournament 10:29 Tariru_: grats! 10:29 really??? 10:29 AmyBSOD\srn: yes 10:29 Mandevil\splat: uhh didn't AmyBSOD\srn just make that edit 10:29 <@Tone\ootc> EPI: Forgotten spells have the same results as failing to read a spellbook of the same level 10:29 aosdict\ito: ? 10:30 there are now two sentences about Tariru getting kotw in jnh 2018 which are redundant 10:30 on the wiki 10:30 FIQ: https://junethack.net/archive/2015/activity.html says that SLASHTHEM kept being played until the very end of 2015's tournament 10:30 hmmm 10:30 ok then 10:30 aosdict\ito: Hm? 10:30 aosdict\ito: I see. 10:30 bhaak: why is 2015-07-01 included there? 10:30 aosdict\ito: Funny, wiki merged the two edits. 10:31 !tell antigulp e - a desert jinn corpse seems wrong to me. i thought & shouldn't leave corpses 10:31 Will do, hothraxxa! 10:31 That said, I don't like the wording. 10:31 seen three of them so far 10:31 Mandevil\splat: Now for some reason, there's no mention that Tariru is the world record vanilla streak holder (in 3.6.0) 10:32 I still see it. 10:32 oh I can't read 10:32 "The edit could not be undone due to conflicting intermediate edits." 10:33 hothraxxa: probably an oversight 10:33 i think so yeah 10:34 like B falling into pits 10:34 shouldn't happen 10:34 desert jinn were a pretty early addition, I wouldn't be surprised if antigulp just didn't know the nuances of the G_* masks at the time 10:34 i should eat one 10:35 oh really, Tariru's FIQhack, xNetHack and SpliceHack ascensions were the first ones for him . 10:35 become the only player to eat a desert jinn? 10:35 Mandevil\splat: it's Tariru 10:35 yeah. maybe choke on it for a unique death 10:35 aosdict\ito: dessert jinn? 10:35 Mandevil\splat: Also slex, earlier this year, not in junethack 10:35 his first slex game was an asc 10:35 his first dyna game was an asc 10:35 and fh, xnh, spl 10:35 possibly others too 10:36 Mandevil\splat: splice specific monster 10:36 FIQ: His first four Dyna games were an ascension streak. 10:36 Naturally 10:36 His first four slex games were also an ascension streak :D 10:36 Mandevil\splat: they wield two short swords 10:36 !asc Tariru_ 10:36 FIQ: [hdf-us] No games for Tariru_. 10:36 !asc Tariru 10:36 FIQ: [hdf-us] Tariru has ascended 1 times in 1 games (100.00%): slex:1 (100.00%) 10:36 FIQ: [hdf-eu] Tariru has ascended 14 times in 14 games (100.00%): sp:1 (100.00%), dnh:1 (100.00%), nh4:1 (100.00%), dyn:1 (100.00%), un:1 (100.00%), spl:1 (100.00%), 4k:1 (100.00%), slex:3 (100.00%), nh343:1 (100.00%), fh:1 (100.00%), xnh:1 (100.00%), gh:1 (100.00%) 10:36 FIQ: Elberethless too :) 10:37 Well, the variants are still mostly pretty similar. If you're an expert at the game, it's not like you have to re-learn a bunch of strategies. 10:37 aosdict\ito: slex, grunt 10:37 i think the problem is confusion as to which does what 10:37 FIQ: IIRC slashthem was removed in the week before junethack 2016 10:37 bhaak: ahh 10:37 FIQ: expert vanilla skill would still translate pretty well to grunt 10:37 aosdict\ito: in fact you DO have to re-learn a bunch of strategies 10:37 and maybe read a wishing spoiler so you know what to wish for 10:38 if you don't then what the hell was vvaried? 10:38 Tariru has a 100% asc rate across 15 games across 11 variants on hdf 10:38 not bad 10:38 anyway slex and grunt are outliers, compared to most other variants. The overall gameplay is similar, is what I mean. 10:38 FIQ: hmm, probably as the tournament end date is configured as '2018-07-01 00:00:00' and the activity page uses <= instead <. but there's SQL stuff involved 10:39 hothraxxa: Suppose that player HP/AC gain is severely restricted and other tweaks made such that monsters are a threat all game. That's definitely a variant, but it doesn't demand you memorise a bunch of specific changes like what you can wish for. 10:40 i suspect it does, actually 10:40 Uh, it demands you memorise a bunch of specific changes that weren't made? 10:40 i wasn't rejecting your speciic example 10:41 it does change the strategies you have to use 10:41 hothraxxa: Nethack is a very tactical game, but most of the basic tactics, like fighting styles and when to retreat, don't change much from variant to variant (assuming you're sticking with vanilla character combinations). 10:41 tactics != strategies 10:41 That's certainly true, but it's less of a barrier to cross-variant knowledge than a bunch of new undocumented minituae. 10:42 ok but now we're arguing where the line falls 10:42 -!- raisse\splat has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:48 Are we? I'm just saying, I think there's a difference between a variant that needs a lot of new memorisation (like, say, Un wishing) and one that makes you do the same things only harder (like, say, fewer wishes). Both have something "varied", but the latter is more amenable to variant-hopping, surely? 10:51 Pinkbeast: Un wishing need memorization? That's new to me. 10:51 I'd say Grunt wishing is an even more extreme example. Not that I disagree with Un wishing. 10:51 Pinkbeast: If something needs memory the size of a planet, then it's dNetHack. 10:52 Mandevil\splat: Well, yes, you have to have a fresh idea of what is good to wish for. 10:52 -!- raisse\splat has joined #hardfought 10:52 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse\splat] by ChanServ 10:52 Pinkbeast: In dNetHack you don't have the faintest idea. 10:52 In Grunt wishing, you need to read up on what armor pieces you can dragonhide, plan your asc kit around those, read the list of object properties and decide how to structure your kit around them, etc etc 10:53 aosdict\ito: Yeah, but it's stil WAAAAY simpler than dnh. 10:53 dnh I know almost nothing about 10:53 Well I know very little about dnh so I don't talk much about it 10:53 Pinkbeast: https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/DNetHack_Artifacts 10:53 Pinkbeast: Look at that. 10:54 I never artiwish anyway but coo, there's a lot of those 10:54 Pinkbeast: I really want to see artiwishless dnethack game. 10:55 Well, actuelly there are some. 11:01 <@Tone\ootc> I love reading the live logs when someone in grunthack gets a wand of wishing 11:03 [hdf-us] [nh361] dracunos (Val Dwa Fem Law) killed Medusa, on T:31581 11:06 [hdf-us] [nh361] Eleven (Hea Hum Mal Neu) killed Death, on T:73698 11:06 <@rikersan\srn> Mandevil: oh tha'ts completely doable 11:06 <@rikersan\srn> (artiwishless dnh game) 11:07 <@rikersan\srn> pirates get extra floor artifacts, and enough demon lords and whatnot have some 11:07 Of course, in grunthack, the most important thing regarding wishing is confirming that the wand of wishing chest is not able to be looted and used by human soldiers, and having a contingency plan ready if it is. 11:07 @rikersan\srn dnh should port xnethack's artiless conduct. then we'll have a real challenge :D 11:08 <@rikersan\srn> good luck lel 11:08 <@escargott'em> I'd like to thank the silver dragon that gave it's scales 11:08 <@escargott'em> And just all giant lizards everywhere 11:08 [hdf-us] [nh361] Eleven (Hea Hum Mal Neu) killed Famine, on T:73723 11:08 <@escargott'em> I don't think I've killed medusa before :p 11:09 -!- Chris_ANG has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:09 <@escargott'em> Maybe I did last June while digging down 11:11 <@escargott'em> So I have silver dragon scale mail, mr cloak, fully enchanted Excalibur, and started training two handed with a random long sword, but perseus had a shield of reflection 11:11 the shield is redundant unless you want to swap out your DSM for something else 11:12 <@escargott'em> There's only so much you can train weapon skills right? Like you can't master two weapon, daggers, and long sword, can you? 11:13 I don't remember how many skill slots it takes to advance stuff 11:13 escargott: https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Skills # yes, there is a limit; but you can easily master two weapons. 11:13 In practice if you aren't planning to raise spell skills, or are the sort of class that can only do a few spell schools to low levels, skill slots aren't an issue. 11:15 <@escargott'em> I guess I'll keep the shield as a back up and keep practicing two weapon 11:15 as an XL 14 valk, I have dagger and long sword at Expert and twoweap at (maximum) Skilled. 11:15 in wizard mode. 11:16 [hdf-us] [nh361] Eleven (Hea Hum Mal Neu), 2195056 points, T:73749, ascended https://www.hardfought.org/userdata/E/Eleven/nh361/dumplog/1529930029.nh361.txt 11:17 [hdf-us] [dnh] rikerw (Ana Hum Mal Neu) entered Minetown for the first time, on T:1914 11:19 -!- bug_sniper has joined #hardfought 11:19 hi 11:19 Hello bug_sniper, Welcome to #hardfought 11:19 o/ 11:23 <@Tone\ootc> Yeah stick with SDSM and twoweapon @escargott'em 11:23 <@Tone\ootc> Twoweapon is really nice 11:23 <@Tone\ootc> And you don't need the shield 11:24 <@Tone\ootc> Only downside to your kit is that you don't have MC3 11:24 <@Tone\ootc> but that's overrated anyways 11:24 <@Tone\ootc> Especially with excal 11:27 [hdf-us] [nh361] Xzight (Val Dwa Fem Law) rejected atheism with a prayer, on T:8447 11:27 <@escargott'em> What does mc protect against that mr and reflect doesn't? 11:28 Junethack: Eleven ascended a game of NetHack 3.6.1 on www.hardfought.org! 11:28 [hdf-us] [4k] Syl (Silver2195) (Wiz Syl Fem Neu) entered the Rogue tribute level, on T:24863 11:28 <@Tone\ootc> Special melee attacks 11:28 <@Tone\ootc> So level drain is the big one, but also paralysis effects and other stuff 11:29 <@Tone\ootc> There's a list on the wiki 11:29 <@Tone\ootc> MC got nerfed in 36x so anything you don't want to be affected by isn't really worth taking a chance with even with MC3 imo 11:30 <@Tone\ootc> Vlad is a pain in 361 now though, I think that's where I would miss MC3 most 11:30 <@Tone\ootc> That and votd 11:30 [hdf-us] [fh] ahrimen (Val Dwa Fem Law) heard a rumor from The Oracle, on T:2383 11:30 <@Tone\ootc> You have excal though so neither of those matter 11:31 <@escargott'em> Wait, I don't have the cloak yet, not sure what I was thinking when I said that :p 11:31 <@escargott'em> But soon 11:34 <@Tone\ootc> oh you don't have MR? lol 11:37 <@escargott'em> I have two games going at once and it's getting confusing 11:37 [hdf-us] [nh361] Xzight (Val Dwa Fem Law), 9698 points, T:9086, killed by a chameleon imitating an elf mummy 11:37 <@IceBox> What's vlad do that mc helps with? 11:38 <@escargott'em> I finished mines, medusa, and soko, still need level 14.. Only 12 so far 11:38 <@Tone\ootc> @IceBox His attack level drains 11:38 <@Tone\ootc> and in 361 he teleports to the stairs 11:38 <@Tone\ootc> So he tends to get a lot more hits in than he used to 11:39 <@Tone\ootc> I lost like 4-6 levels to him last time I think 11:40 <@Tone\ootc> That's a little extreme but it can happen if you aren't careful 11:42 <@IceBox> Oh man thank goodness I had a cloak of protection I did not research him enough 11:42 <@Tone\ootc> You probably had Excalibur too 11:42 <@escargott'em> How can Tone "dip the boh" Johnson not be careful 11:42 <@Tone\ootc> Excalibur fully protects against level drain 11:43 <@Tone\ootc> @escargott'em 😩 11:43 <@IceBox> Oh yeah I forgot resistance in vanilla means immunity basically haha 11:43 <@escargott'em> I've had Excalibur do many times I forgot what it does 11:44 <@escargott'em> Automatic searching! 11:44 <@escargott'em> No wonder I keep waking statues without standing on them 11:44 <@IceBox> The only other way to get mc3 is with armor plus a ring right? 11:45 <@Tone\ootc> MC2 armor, yeah 11:45 <@Tone\ootc> Mitre of holiness gives +1 now too I think 11:45 <@Tone\ootc> Unless I'm getting my artifacts mixed up 11:45 <@escargott'em> There are additive sources? 11:45 <@Tone\ootc> No 11:46 <@Tone\ootc> You only get the bonus from one source 11:46 <@Tone\ootc> So two rings won't stack 11:46 <@escargott'em> Why does armor plus a ring matter then 11:46 <@IceBox> In different armors that provide it don't stack either 11:46 !tell antigulp this dragon is only seen through telepathy but i got: You hear a chugging sound. The silver dragon is covered in a silvery sheen! also, i don't think silver dragons should drink potions of reflection 11:46 Will do, hothraxxa! 11:46 <@Tone\ootc> And there aren't many MC2 sources now either 11:47 <@Tone\ootc> @escargott'em the external protection sources augment it by +1 11:47 <@escargott'em> So external sources are additive? Up to +1? 11:49 <@Tone\ootc> You get your armor bonus and one external source basically 11:49 <@escargott'em> Why make this so complicated, and then make it so level 3 isn't even effective enough to count on anyway 11:50 <@escargott'em> Three different levels of resistance 11:50 <@escargott'em> But you and up with mc1 without even trying anyway 11:50 <@Tone\ootc> I never realized how complicated they made it until I had to explain it. And we haven't even talked about intrinsic protection granting a non-stacking MC1 11:50 <@escargott'em> It's not even as important as reflect or mr, but it has multiple levels and shows up on all sorts of items 11:51 <@Tone\ootc> MC3 is still a nice bonus over 2. It just isn't the bear immunity it was in 343 11:51 hothraxxa: yeah that's a canspotmon() check. Perhaps should be canseemon(). 11:51 EPI: negative MC values 11:52 its like coding in murphy's law 11:52 <@Tone\ootc> If you want to fight through votd you'd be much better off with MC3 than 2 11:52 if anything bad can happen, it WILL happen 11:52 bear immunity? 11:52 bear immunity would be a pretty nice thing to have. "The owlbear hits you, but it bounces off!" 11:53 <@rikersan\srn> why aren't more bears in nethack, huh 11:53 <@rikersan\srn> I would expect like a grizzly or something 11:53 <@escargott'em> The owl part still hurts though 11:53 <@Tone\ootc> haha I just saw what I said aosdict 11:53 <@Tone\ootc> I meant near immunity 😄 11:53 once upon a time there were a bear and a rabbit... 11:53 yeah @Tone that one's going on qdb :D 11:53 <@rikersan\srn> > K2 is eating noisily. Looks like it will take 132 turns to finish. 11:53 <@rikersan\srn> why tho 11:53 <@rikersan\srn> why do you eat the hunting horror corpse 11:54 i is hangry 11:54 not hungry 11:54 HANGRY 11:54 <@rikersan\srn> lol, you're a master mind flayer 11:54 good 11:54 <@Tone\ootc> There aren't even bears in VotD! 11:54 <@rikersan\srn> wait are MMFs traitors 11:54 @rikersan\srn probably because a bear would be another boring non-special monster with maybe some claw and bite attacks? ultimately more chaff. 11:54 -!- stenno\ito has joined #hardfought 11:54 <@escargott'em> I thought you just meant like 'it was a bear of an immunity' 11:54 <@rikersan\srn> I guess yeah 11:54 <@rikersan\srn> @d?master mind flayer 11:54 also, regular bears don't fit nicely into any mlets. 11:54 master mind flayer (h) | Lvl: 13 | Diff: 17 | Spd: 12 | Res: poison | Confers: nothing | MR: 90 | Generates: gehennom dungeons | AC: 0 | Attacks: 1d8 weapon physical, 1d4 tentacle drain int, 1d2 tentacle drain int, 1d2 tentacle drain int | Alignment: 0 | Flags: genocidable, omnivore, flies, seeinvis, infravisible 11:55 <@rikersan\srn> ok good, k2 gets a lightsaber then 11:55 nice 11:55 <@escargott'em> Like how old people say bear as an adjective 11:55 I guess bears could get AT_HUGS, for bear hugs. 11:55 i am a jedi fucking master 11:55 aosdict\ito: probably Y with the owlbears. 11:55 not that bears are at all apelike creatures 11:57 <@escargott'em> Make a more interesting bear then 11:57 I think Fourk with its mlet rearrangement reserves U for ursine (sp?) creatures. 11:57 <@rikersan\srn> oh FUCK it does turn traitor 11:57 <@rikersan\srn> k2 why do you do this to me 11:57 <@rikersan\srn> I gae you like a nice saber and everything 11:57 <@escargott'em> Like a dancing bear, it forces you to dance for three turns like paralysis but only resisted by mc3 11:57 <@rikersan\srn> that's too slexy 11:57 i was luring you in 11:58 i am not a jedi. i am a sith lord 11:58 it's treason then 11:58 bhaak: do you already know that line of sight is broken in unnethack gehennom? 11:58 just re-charm me 11:58 <@rikersan\srn> aosdict keep your memes out of here 11:58 <@rikersan\srn> k2 I don't have any 11:58 ply me with nice shiny things 11:58 <@rikersan\srn> that was a figurine 11:58 maybe a back rub 11:58 <@rikersan\srn> and the wiki has no info on traitors, how do I stop that from happening? 11:58 aosdict\ito: Bears are planned for U, yes. 11:59 As soon as I work up the nerve to try do draw tiles for them. 11:59 jonadab: what other bears are you thinking of adding 11:59 <@escargott'em> What kind of bear 11:59 <@escargott'em> It needs to be distinct 11:59 black bear, brown bear, grizzley bear, polar bear, werebear, dire bear 12:00 <@escargott'em> No flame bear? Or frost bear 12:00 rabbit bear 12:00 but how do you prevent most of those from becoming chaff monsters 12:00 Frost bear would be redundant with polar bear 12:00 someone make a sharknado 12:00 Would be tempted to also do drop bears, but trees aren't abundant enough in NetHack to make it worthwhile really. 12:00 <@escargott'em> Polar bears have frost breath? Til 12:00 Heh. 12:00 No, but. 12:00 and of course they're cold resistant 12:00 I suppose I could call them "ice bears" (real-world polar bears are called this in some places...) 12:01 And yes, obviously they are cold resistant. 12:01 yes, in Dutch they are "ijsbeer" 12:01 <@escargott'em> And they should drop bear arms 12:01 well since you're not going to do it: YANI: drop bears: hiding monsters, maybe t-class, can only spawn next to a tree. They don't engulf, but deal most of their damage via their drop. 12:02 maybe relax next to a tree to be within a certain radius 12:02 You are hit by a falling drop bear! 12:02 those things are *heavy* 12:02 then there should also be black stumps 12:02 <@escargott'em> What if you have a hard helmet 12:03 honestly the hard helmet mechanics should be reworked to account for blunt damage 12:03 then you're still crushed beneath it for 3d8 damage or so 12:03 if a boulder falls on your head, your helmet really shouldn't do much at all 12:03 <@rikersan\srn> well ok 12:03 aosdict\ito: As for making them not be chaff monsters, bears are faster than humans (maybe speed 15ish) IRL, so that's a good start. 12:03 <@rikersan\srn> k2 just suicided 12:03 <@rikersan\srn> damn blue jellies 12:03 <@rikersan\srn> uh so yeah RIP? 12:03 :( 12:04 <@escargott'em> It's a falling rock, not a boulder 12:04 And they would clearly have a decent number of hitpoints. 12:04 And hit kinda hard. 12:04