00:37 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 00:37 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse] by ChanServ 01:21 thanks K2, will do 01:28 -!- elenmirie_ has joined #hardfought 01:32 -!- elenmirie has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:32 -!- elenmirie_ is now known as elenmirie 01:32 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v elenmirie] by ChanServ 01:33 -!- raisse has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:35 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 01:35 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse] by ChanServ 02:09 -!- raisse has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:13 -!- Porkman has joined #hardfought 03:33 -!- khoR_ has joined #hardfought 03:33 -!- khoR is now known as KhorZ 03:33 -!- Porkman has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:35 -!- khoR_ is now known as khoR 04:35 -!- nht has joined #hardfought 04:55 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 04:55 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse] by ChanServ 05:29 FIQ: I tried to write charging scroll and the game told me I dont know that scroll. But on the item discovery list it's there. :S 05:29 scroll called scroll of charging (DUAM XNAHT) 05:33 "called" 05:33 yeah but it says that with everything 05:33 I used charging before on markers 05:33 Aha. 05:33 Well, looks buggy. 05:33 its weird tho 05:34 yeah why does it say called 05:34 I wouldnt call earth "scroll of earth" 05:34 I would just call it earth 05:35 Yeah. 05:35 Something is defintely off. 05:35 And I'm 100% sure I havent called half of this items. 05:35 but some other scrolls are good 05:35 * khoR shakes fist at FIQ 05:35 Now im stuck and can't keep going because I need to set up for the late game and I need my marker for that. :( 05:36 Just wait for FIQ to fix it. 05:36 Yeah but I'm bored now! 05:36 Oh gosh. 05:36 You can play test devnull ;) 05:36 What is that? 05:36 devnull? 05:37 test devnull 05:37 I know that devnull is a tournament. 05:37 Yes, but devnull was retired. 05:37 And there's a "devnull tribute" tournament instead. 05:37 .-. 05:38 It will use the original challenges, but is ported into 3.6.0 05:38 And the surrounding infrastruture is completely new. 05:38 So testing is welcome. 05:39 I'm not good with challenges though. 05:39 As shown by all my splatted pacifists. 05:39 Challenges are not conducts. 05:39 You never played in devnull? 05:40 No, tournaments were always outside my nethack frenzies. 05:40 I only played junethack once and I didnt do that much. 05:40 Challenges are little minigames that unlock certain actions in NetHack. 05:41 Pac-Man, Waldo, Joust, ZAPM etc. 05:42 wat 05:42 pacman? 05:42 xD 05:42 https://nethackwiki.com/wiki//dev/null/nethack_tournament#Challenges 05:44 -!- Tokage has joined #hardfought 05:44 All right. 05:45 I have magic resistance, some very fancy dragonhide boots, good sources of both direct (Magic Missile) and indirect (Fireball, Cone of Cold) attack power, I can Identify and theoretically (with 1% odds) to map levels, and I successfully genocided beholders. 05:46 Oh, and my luck is nearly maxed out, granting me the ability to write unknown scrolls and spellbooks - though my magic marker's recharged once and nearly run out. 05:47 However, I'm lacking in reflection, I've got a limited amount of power, my armor class is barely in the negatives, and I'm extremely concerned by just how much damage the heavier hitters in this game can deal. 05:47 I've fucked up more promising games, in the far easier vanilla. We'll see where this goes. 05:47 Tokage: Is that GruntHack? 05:48 Yes. 05:48 Lack of reflection is quite serious thing. 05:48 HAve you cleared the castle? 05:49 No. I'm at floor 11. 05:49 Having managed to prepare this well this early on is a fairly good sign as well, I suppose. 05:50 I think down to Castle shouldn't be all that bad. 05:50 You're wizard? 05:51 http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/396/589/5fa.jpg 05:52 DIED: Khor (Val-Dwa-Fem-Law), 551 points, killed by a hobbit on hardfought 05:52 But I only wanted to see the pacman minigame. :c 05:52 Tokage: Too bad, I guess you can't sacrifice for weapons. 05:52 No, but I can get crowned for Finger of Death. 05:54 Also, I just got nearly killed by an elf with a wand of cold, resetting my prayer timeout, and then I fell into a trap door and three levels lower down. 05:54 Oh but I didnt get teleported 05:54 I need to find a magic portal or something? 05:54 And of course the wand ran out of charges. 05:54 Things are looking a bit down now. 05:55 khoR: Yes. 05:55 khoR: It's on the page I linked. 05:55 Not sure where pacman portal is. 05:55 A lot of things are in the page you linked. 05:55 :P 05:56 It's on Oracle level. 05:56 Yeah I sawnow. 05:56 I guess I'm not doing it then. 05:56 I just wanna ascend the priest. 05:56 * khoR throws stones at FIQ's window. 05:57 That's not very polite. 05:57 not like 05:57 big stones 05:57 small stones 05:57 like in old movies 05:57 you know 05:57 pebbles 05:57 I guess 06:00 Election day today... 06:01 * Mandevil waves the pirate flag 06:03 Can I vote for making politics illegal? 06:03 Here people are withdrawing the money from the banks just in case. 06:03 xD 06:04 Ow. 06:04 jonadab: Politics can't be avoided. 06:04 jonadab: Just like laws of nature cannot be avoided. 06:04 Are you trying to tell me politics is _natural_? 06:05 In a society, yes. 06:06 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) had gold spellbook bestowed upon him by Anhur, on T:15590 06:13 I'm actually pretty scared 06:13 khoR: But not scared enough to flee to Canada? 06:14 Fuck's sakes. 06:14 A zombie just ate my brain and now I can't remember most of the levels and half my inventory. 06:15 Oh, and it got me ill. Good thing I had an eucalyptus leaf, but that's not going to work a second time. 06:16 * jonadab can imagine khoR moving to the Toronto area. 06:16 I have no idea where I would go to be honest. 06:18 Multiple choice: do you pick Prague, Paris, Tokyo, Toronto, Los Angeles, or Mexico City? 06:19 Or, heh, Norilsk. 06:22 I would probably enjoy tokyo but I don't think I could handle their work ethig 06:22 ethic 06:22 Indeed. 06:23 So that narrows down the list by one... 06:27 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) averted death, on T:17340 06:27 I can see why reflection is an issue. 06:27 Magic resistance doesn't protect from sleep? Come on. 06:28 * khoR wanted to ascend today 06:30 DIED: machinespray (Val-Dwa-Fem-Law), 6321 points, killed by a cobra, while frozen by a monster's gaze on hardfought 06:30 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) was chosen to steal souls for the Glory of Anhur, on T:17470 06:30 khoR: So you're playing slex? 06:31 No 06:31 I'm playing BugHack 06:32 Im ready to enter gehennom but can't because charging scrolls are bugged 06:32 I know them and have even used them before 06:32 but it doesnt let me write them 06:32 so im sitting here with a marker and a wand of wishing to charge 06:33 and wasted charges on the marker too because I was suposed to be able to write charging but it didnt work 06:33 I guess I can go hoard more items 06:34 ... 06:34 nevermind 06:34 game crashed again 06:34 fuck this 06:35 FIQ: https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/6WiHhQbd/ 06:37 Does the Dark One have any new really nasty abilities, or can I take him on as I am now? 06:42 Not sure. 06:42 I think he's mostly unchanged. 06:42 But I haven't won a wizard. 06:43 I was wondering about all the dead mimics on this level, and then I found k2's ghost. 06:45 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) had vellum spellbook bestowed upon him by Anhur, on T:18823 06:49 how long between prayers for it to be safe? 06:49 was it 1k turns´? 06:49 Much longer. 06:50 mmm 06:50 meh 06:50 khor: https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Prayer_timeout 06:50 khoR: There are some probability plots at the bottom. 06:53 It uses the bizzare rnz() function. 06:54 BTW, that would be cool if someone came up with something more sane. 06:54 Being blinded and surrounded by monsters on lvl 1 06:54 is such a balanced trap 06:54 K2, why did you leave all your good gear so far away from where you died? 06:54 oh fucking hell 06:54 why do I get ALL thebones 06:55 Tokage: Teleport? 06:55 I have yet to play a single game of FIQH without bones 06:55 khoR: Complaining about getting free gear? 06:55 * for some definitions of "free" 06:55 It feels like cheating. 06:56 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) wished for "blessed fixed greased +2 dragonhide cloak of magic resistance and reflection", on T:19486 06:56 Tokage: Castle? Or some random wish? 06:56 Now we're talking. 06:56 Random wish. 06:56 K2's bones contained all this good shit in a pile far away from where he actually died. 06:56 Including an amulet of life saving. 06:56 I'd love to hear the circumstances behind this death. 06:57 This dog runs away instead of fighting 06:57 soannoying 06:58 what 06:58 is it wounded? 06:58 in fiqhack you dont start learning the spells from your spellbooks 06:58 oh my god... 06:58 well rip my dog 06:58 and my pacifist run I guess 06:58 khoR: Why are you trying pacifist? 06:59 Because I can't play my non pacifist game and it's something I have pending for a long time. 06:59 I have that pending for years :) 06:59 "The incubus smiles at the orcish zombie seductively." 06:59 Gross, man. 07:00 Hehe. 07:00 its ok 07:00 I can just run the whole game without pets right? 07:00 What could go wrong? 07:00 oh hey 07:00 another bones level 07:00 what a surprise 07:00 * khoR deactivates bones on the option file 07:01 and with a panther 07:01 of course 07:01 why not 07:01 fffffffffffffffffffffjkshcgjlhsfjlghsdjkfg 07:01 [fh] Frisk (Khor) (Hea Gno Mal Neu), 21591 points, T:1607, killed by a panther 07:03 Did you try to pet the panther? 07:05 looks like the panther got him 07:10 khoR: !bones 07:13 Yeah I turned bones off 07:13 a bones level every now and then is cool 07:13 but this many is just... 07:13 Specially with how other players seem to butcher the levels. 07:18 Anhur, please stop sending incubi at my end. I am a guy. 07:31 Oh, great, I got my brain eaten again. 07:31 khoR: object detection? 07:31 Nevermind that my armor class is now -23, no, fuck that.- 07:31 Zombies don't give a fuck. 07:32 if so, I did tell you that the server version was outdated 07:32 So I just have to #quit my perfectly ascendable game? 07:32 I cant write charging scrolls either. 07:32 also regarding markers 07:32 :\ 07:32 it's working as intended 07:32 something gave you amnesia 07:33 wat 07:33 you need to formally know the ID to write it 07:33 pff 07:33 khoR: no? 07:33 just because K2 hasn't updated yet doesn't mean that you need to quit 07:35 Oh, I understood it as my save not benig up to date. 07:36 but i can still write charging out of luck right? 07:38 khoR: luck doesn't determine whether or not yo u can write charging 07:38 XL does + potential priest bonus 07:38 once you do successfully write a scroll however, in FIQHack, it is formally IDed 07:40 Not ingame luck 07:40 but luck as in 07:40 universal concept 07:40 xD 07:40 like 07:41 if I try to write and I have a 33% chance 07:41 and I get it 07:41 I was "lucky" 07:42 F - a blessed scroll of charging. 07:42 I was lucky 07:42 º3º 07:42 nice :) 07:43 [fh] Khor (Pri Hum Mal Law) wished for "blessed orb of detection", on T:20495 07:43 wat 07:43 why was I blasted 07:43 I thought I was lawful 07:44 That's a quest artifact. 07:44 So it's cross-aligned unless you are an Arc. 07:44 You still get blasted if you're not an archeologist. 07:44 :| 07:44 Being of the same alignment just means you can pick it up and use it at all. 07:44 That's vanilla behavior. 07:44 I can't keep up with all the special cases in this kurwa game 07:44 Do I still get the magic resistance and half spell damage when carrying it? 07:45 Oh, the special cases aren't the tricky part in NetHack. It's all the _exceptions_ to the special cases you have to worry about. 07:45 xDDD 07:45 [fh] Khor (Pri Hum Mal Law) wished for "blessed fixed amulet of life saving", on T:20496 07:46 does the orb still give me mr and half spell damage tho? 07:46 if so im gonna go down again and grab those yellow dragon scales 07:47 I _think_ so, but I am not _fully_ up to date on FIQHack changes. 07:47 Does the orb even *give* MR? 07:47 Is there a reason you didn't wish for the magic mirror of merlin 07:48 FIQ: In 3.4, it gives ESP, MR, and half spell damage when carried. 07:48 So it's just a question of whether FIQHack changes it. 07:48 well 07:48 why have telepathy and magic resistance 07:48 when I can have telepathy, magic resistance and half spell damage 07:48 jonadab: Well 07:48 It doesn't 07:49 So it still confers them 07:49 khoR: Depends how much you care about carry cap. 07:49 I care 0 07:49 khoR: Well the mirror weights like 5 07:49 ^ 07:49 compared to the orb's 150 07:49 Sure 07:49 look at my dnh ascensions 07:49 how many of them are with the heaviest armor in the game 07:49 Sorry, it weights 13 07:49 the mirror that is 07:54 !tell K2 +Beholder │ K2: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-19 10:19 EDT: FIQHack updated 07:54 Will do, FIQ! 07:55 khoR: you can quiver spells in FIQHack 07:55 I have force bolt on quiver 07:55 ah 07:55 just figured I'd point it out due to your use of dig 07:55 you can also map keys to "castalias" if you have any free 07:55 wat 07:55 which allows you to have several keys mapped to spells 07:56 khoR: as in 07:56 if there is keys you don't use 07:56 that you want to map to spells 07:56 you can map them to "castalias" in options -> interface options -> keymap 07:57 hm 07:57 ok 07:57 I wonder where those scales are tho 07:57 :| 07:57 it would be cool if there was a find item spell 07:58 detect treasure? 07:58 or ctrl+f 07:58 but that shows me all the items 07:58 im looking for yellow dragon scales 07:58 so... ctrl+f? 07:58 do ctrl+f 07:58 search for yellow dragon scales 07:59 khoR: do you even know ctrl+f is a thing 07:59 oh lol 07:59 I didnt know this 07:59 loool 07:59 it's a FIQHack feature 07:59 10/10 07:59 I think it would bebetter in spell form but watev 08:00 why should UI convenience be a spell? 08:00 well 08:00 I don't know if my english is good enough to answer that 08:00 but not remembering where you left something or being able to see it at first sight is not really a ui issue or a downside of the medium the game is on 08:00 in real life, it happens too 08:01 and if you leave a pile of stuff some place 08:01 I see what you mean 08:01 and the thing you are looking for is under that 08:01 you wouldnt be able to see it either 08:01 but it violates the Interhack principe 08:01 so it seems kind of "magical" to be able to know where it is like that 08:01 I dont know what interhack is 08:02 the Interhack principe -- any kind of challenge/difficulty/etc that can be abstracted away by taking notes or playing an UI enhancer like Interhack 08:02 is not a real challenge/difficulty 08:02 for example, amnesia removing knowledge of maps or items 08:03 I don't agree with that 08:03 sure 08:03 buy I understand people that disagree with em 08:03 that's an opinio though :P 08:03 me 08:03 :) 08:03 yeah exactly 08:03 yeah 08:03 I have the samme issue with hearthstone 08:03 *opinion 08:04 they say that everything that gives you information that you could keep on a notebook is not a cheat 08:04 so theres software to help you play 08:04 exactly 08:04 same thing 08:04 that keeps track of cardsin your deck, or your oponent 08:04 mhm 08:04 plays that are played 08:04 what turn cards in your oponent hand were drawn 08:04 all sort of stuff like that 08:04 which is such an unfair advantage over someone whod oesnt have it 08:04 even tho you could keep track of it on a notebook 08:05 it takes a way such a big part of the skillset needed for card games 08:05 It even gives you % on how lickely it is to draw a ceratin card 08:05 certain* 08:05 pretty sure even some RL card games like MTG allows you to take notes of what you have in your deck and stuff? 08:05 same thing 08:05 Yes 08:06 But having that automatically... 08:06 You wouldnt be able to keep up with so much information. 08:06 On a notebook. 08:06 no different, just less tedious 08:09 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed the Dark One, on T:24980 08:09 He was resistant to magic so I had to poke him to death with Magicbane. 08:10 What kind of a wizard duel was that supposed to be? 08:10 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) picked up the Bell of Opening, on T:24983 08:12 -!- K2-webirc has joined #hardfought 08:12 Hey K2. What was up with that pile of great treasure, including an amulet of life saving, so far away from your actual dead body? 08:12 It feels like there's a story there. 08:14 blasting with fireball/cone of cold is more fun 08:14 Tokage: to answer your question from earlier about my bones in grunthack - sometimes if I have a game that's going badly and I don't feel it's worth salvaging, if I have time I'll drop all my gear in a pile, move away from it and let myself get killed 08:14 hah i was typing before i saw your msg ;) 08:15 so that way the pile isnt cursed 08:15 Well, thanks I guess. 08:15 and myself or another player has a chance to find some decent loot 08:15 yup 08:15 Although if I had a magic lamp, I wouldn't say a game was going poorly. 08:15 CHEATS! 08:15 BANNED! 08:15 hah 08:15 * K2-webirc bans himself 08:15 * khoR keeps !bones 08:16 Tokage: i probably didnt know what most of my gear was 08:17 This was on level 13. You could've long since price-IDd it at Izthak. 08:17 You've no excuses. 08:17 ahahah 08:18 you're welcome 08:20 FIQ: how about this having to press enter an extra time everytime I do anything involving inventory letters' 08:20 is pretty annoying 08:21 and even if my window is small, should be standard size for nh 08:22 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) wished for "blessed fixed greased +2 helm of brilliance and drain resistance", on T:25502 08:23 Oh boy. 08:23 I got TWO genies from two potions of extra healing, in a row! 08:24 nice 08:24 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) wished for "blessed fixed +2 dragonhide gauntlets of dexterity and power", on T:25518 08:24 Try and stop me NOW, grunt! 08:25 dont jinx it :) 08:25 I've still got Demogorgon to deal with. He worries me. 08:27 khoR: "standard size" 08:27 with that said, I agree that it's kinda bad 08:28 jonadab: what is nethacks standard size? 08:29 [fh] Khor (Pri Hum Mal Law) wished for "uncursed partly eaten magic marker", on T:21512 08:34 khoR: 80x24 i thought 08:34 EXACTLY 08:34 FUCK 08:34 +4 08:34 KURWA ENCHANT ARMOR 08:36 [fh] Khor (Pri Hum Mal Law) wished for "blessed partly eaten magic marker", on T:21626 08:41 +4 armor makes me irattionally angry 08:41 +4 is good 08:41 I have two +4s. 08:42 +4 is literally the worst 08:42 hitler was better than +4 armor 08:43 p - a blessed greased fireproof +4 robe (being worn) {8} 08:43 * khoR flips his table 08:44 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed Croesus, on T:26810 08:45 I did? 08:45 He was right on the other side of the room. All I did was wear a ring of conflict. 08:48 you made it possible for him to be killed :-) 08:50 ok I'm ready for gehennom next week 08:50 oh wait 08:51 I still have to see if I can get more maxhp 08:51 yeah I can a bit 08:51 like maybe 50 more 08:52 khoR: MZ_MEDIUM which is also MZ_HUMAN ? 08:53 ? 08:53 khoR > jonadab: what is nethacks standard size? 08:53 * khoR facepalms 08:55 lol 08:56 !tell ais523 can you change the devnull_nethack topic to point to https://www.hardfought.org/devnull/ please? 08:56 Will do, raisse! 08:57 [slex] Tarrant (Alt Bre Mal Cha), 662 points, T:1434, killed by a monster (black dirtbag) 09:02 YANI: being able to wish for magic items with a bane to a specific unique creature. 09:02 For instance, demogorgonbane. 09:02 Basically useless against anything else, but deals massive damage to the one creature they're made to kill. 09:02 Rodneybane! 09:02 Cthulhubane 09:03 BoredomBane :( 09:03 mysteriousforcebane 09:03 Wish for a Vladbane and you just get a tin opener. 09:04 last time around I killed Vlad with my pet Olog-hai wielding a mattock 09:04 or a battle-axe, I forget which 09:07 But yeah. My luck and divine protection are both maxed out, my armor class is at -40s, I've completed my guest, I'm fully decked out, and I no longer know what to wish when I complete the castle. 09:07 Way I see it, barring something tenuous and especially nasty grunthack still has in store for me, only Demogorgon can stop me now. 09:07 I still fear him. I've never beaten him. 09:14 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed Medusa, on T:28630 09:14 Kicked the door in and pointed a mirror at her - she didn't even get to do anything. 09:17 Curious... 09:17 This troll was only carrying a wand of magic missile, but when I started eating him and he raised from the dead, the next time around he also had some food rations. 09:17 Where did he get those? 09:25 when trolls respawn they have a chance to have new loot 09:26 technically a bug I suppose 09:26 Yes. 09:26 I consider that a bug. 09:26 Though not a very large or important one. 09:26 could respawn with a wand of death 09:26 that'd be bad 09:26 Anything that spawns can spawn with that (if it's not mindless and has hands), though. 09:27 So the thing with trolls isn't strategically important. 09:27 But yes, it's clearly incorrect. 09:27 yup 09:32 DIED: khamul (Sam-Hum-Mal-Law), 5730 points, killed by a horse on hdf-eu 09:34 what happens if you wish for a partly eaten dragon scale mail? 09:35 Okay. 09:35 nothing, probably 09:35 I got the wand of wishing and have no idea what to wish for. 09:35 And then I drank a potion of extra healing and got a djinni with a wish from there too! 09:35 clearly you should wish for more extra healing 09:36 I can just reverse-genocide for nurses. 09:36 Maybe I'll wish for energy instead. It keeps running out even with the Eye, and the Amulet of Yendor sure isn't going to help. 09:37 Or try for Master Key of Thievery, even though all it does that I don't already have is half physical damage. 09:37 Nope. 10:22 -!- raisse has quit [Quit: Raisse suddenly disappears!] 10:23 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 10:23 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse] by ChanServ 10:23 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) entered Gehennom for the first time, on T:32289 10:27 -!- K2-webirc has left #hardfought 10:33 -!- Tokage has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:49 -!- Grasshopper has joined #hardfought 10:49 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v Grasshopper] by ChanServ 11:00 jonadab: except it isn't true 11:00 things that respawn respawn as if they were undead turned 11:01 and will not get new items... 11:01 they can still deathdrop, however 11:02 Ah. 11:02 Maybe the deathdrop is what we're seeing. 11:02 DT makes more opportunities at taking my reports into EPIs 11:02 you can no longer cast spells when polymorphed into something that can't speak, or is being strangled 11:02 I kind of want to kill deathdrops entirely, in favor of giving monsters a totally random item in starting inventory a percentage of the time. Would players lynch me? 11:02 4fad1ba3cca44c2a8553c92531912fa05de4ab8a 11:03 jonadab: Well in FIQHack they'd probably use the item for themselves... less so in 4k :P 11:05 jonadab: if you make it a 1/6 chance of a random item following the normal odds, there should really be very little observable difference 11:05 s/normal odds/normal other rules 11:05 jonadab, just wondering but why aren't you collecting bad ideas from #em.slashem.me? 11:06 bug_sniper: I don't have logs of that channel. 11:06 I guess the muse stuff with things like weapons/armor/misc usable items might be bad 11:06 or make the game a little harder 11:07 if deathdrops turned into stuff in starting inventory 11:07 it wouldn't make too much of a difference outside FIQHack I think 11:07 in fh it'd be a quite major blow to loot though I'd imagine 11:07 since generated enchant weapon, identify, etc would just be used 11:08 or a generated wand of wishing... lol 11:08 what do monsters use identify for in fh? 11:08 to identify stuff 11:08 that's generally what you use identify for :P 11:08 FIQHack monsters know base type of items 11:08 but not BUC, enchantment or charge count, etc 11:09 for that it needs to ID, or use-test 11:09 this is why in FIQHack you can see monsters try to zap an empty wand 11:09 "The hill orc zaps a wand of create monster! Nothing happens." 11:09 huh, so they would blow a ?oID to save one turn trying to zap an empty wand? Seems a bit silly 11:10 it matters more for BUC 11:10 for example, monsters reading or casting ID on a scroll of genocide 11:10 to see if it's cursed or not 11:10 aosdict: They know if they don't use it, the terrible Adventurer is just going to come along and use it after killing them. 11:11 Like the kobolds in Smart Kobolds breaking their bow when they're about to die. 11:11 aosdict: besides 11:11 from a tactical POV 11:11 if a hill orc has a scroll of ID and a wand of create monster 11:11 it makes sense, if they don't care about conserving consumables, to read the ID 11:11 since then they know before combat when the wand is empty or not 11:11 and don't have to waste turns during combat on it 11:12 jonadab: if monsters didn't read/cast ID, monsters would never revgeno 11:12 FIQ: YANI: some types of monsters are more likely to "save" things for later if their immediate use for it is not very compelling; other types of monsters want immediate gratification and will use everything immediately. 11:12 (intentionally, at least) 11:13 jonadab: currently FIQHack monsters are generally of the latter type 11:13 but I've considered looking into making the AI conserve things 11:13 mostly for pets 11:14 I think certain monsters should just be hoarders. 11:14 Like trolls maybe. 11:14 Dragons 11:14 unicorns? 11:14 dragons can't even use items 11:14 they have no hands :P 11:14 Dragons of course, yes, but yeah. 11:14 Not that a hoarder wouldn't use an item in a life-or-death situation, obviously. 11:14 aosdict: did you see my link a while back from jonadab's host? 11:14 But they'd prefer to save it if possible. 11:14 regarding monster intelligence 11:14 player monsters too :) 11:15 [nd] Eleven (Rog Hum Fem Cha), 4905 points, T:7668, killed by a little dog 11:15 aosdict: something I wanted to do was to replace the wiztower zoo with 12 player monsters, all of the role you are *not* 11:15 If there's anyone in the dungeon who hoards items, it's player monsters. 11:16 who will attempt to dispose of you and steal your stuff once they see you, or if you attempt to skip wiztower once you have the amulet 11:16 who aren't *physically* strong like i.e. minotaurs, but have their own ascension kits 11:16 FIQ: the link with the monster attributes? 11:16 aosdict: yeah 11:17 not sure what you wanted me to take away from it 11:17 You wanted to categorize monsters based on intelligence 11:17 Which that basically does 11:18 No, I just had some ideas for if monsters had an Int stat, which is closer to what you're doing. 11:19 ah 11:20 -!- K2-webirc has joined #hardfought 11:21 you could do a system of monster inherent intelligence, but a straight up Int number is probably a lot simpler. 11:21 booyah 11:21 -!- nht has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:24 -!- khoR has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 11:27 -!- Tokage has joined #hardfought 11:45 YANI: an opening beam, cast at an already unlocked door, will open the door. 11:45 DIED: firemonkey (Bar-Orc-Mal-Cha), 259 points, eaten by a Grue on hardfought 11:47 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) bribed Asmodeus with 1344 zorkmids for safe passage, on T:32819 11:53 -!- Porkman has joined #hardfought 11:59 !pom 11:59 raisse: The moon is new for 3 more days. 12:00 good 12:00 bonfire tonight with clear skies, stars are going to look amazing 12:02 [nd] Grasshopper (Kni Hum Fem Law) wished for "uncursed magic marker", on T:38508 12:02 you'll need to get away from the bonfire to get a good look at the stars though 12:03 firemonkey, how did you get eaten by a grue? 12:03 I thought that was an ADOM monster 12:03 it's also a devnull challenge 12:04 if you accept the challenge, and you stay too long in a dark room without a light, the grue eats you 12:04 I accepted the grue challenge on the tribute game 12:04 bug_sniper: it's from Zork originally 12:04 which seems to be a bad idea 12:04 -!- LarienTelrunya has joined #hardfought 12:05 I'm not sure what the incentive is for accepting the challenges? 12:05 Just bragging rights? 12:05 Trophies? 12:05 trophies -> bragging rights 12:05 hohum 12:06 Hey, look. A pit fiend caught me in a bear hug and dealt all of two points of damage before dying. 12:06 Perhaps this is no cakewalk just yet. 12:06 and some of the challenges are just plain fun 12:06 I like the waldo challenge 12:06 say, seducing malcanthet for carrying capacity... bad idea? 12:10 Interesting... The Uruk-hai wields a crude bow! 12:15 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) bribed Baalzebub with 27 zorkmids for safe passage, on T:33539 12:15 Guess how many gold pieces I carry in my bag. 12:16 Yes, demon lords should really demand an amount of gold that doesn't depend on what you have, or else take your hidden gold into account. 12:17 ok, The Pool Cue of the Tapioca was up to that challenge 12:18 YANI: in addition to Lord Surtur, all elemental giants (fire, frost, storm) gain an extra claw attack with their type of elemental damage. 12:18 Right now they are just stone giants who convey resistances. 12:18 but then you'd have to have the opportunity to get gold from your bag, like in a shop 12:18 sounds like we're playing castle of the winds, with these elemental giants and surtur 12:18 ooh castle of the winds *nostalgia* 12:19 * LarienTelrunya was addicted to CoW for over a decade 12:19 many a slex feature is inspired by it, including many of the nasty traps :D 12:19 (savegame hex editing ftw) 12:21 * aosdict reads wikipedia article for it 12:21 yellow spells 12:21 "Spells are divided into six categories: attack, defense, healing, movement, divination, and miscellaneous." 12:21 sounds familiar... 12:22 FIQ: yep, that originates in CoW - a glitch where the spell icons would get yellow borders, and (only on Windows 3.1) the game screen would stop refreshing correctly 12:22 -!- ri-corpse-san has joined #hardfought 12:22 there's also green spells and red spells 12:23 ah, well in CoW the spell colors I've seen were different too, but most of the time they became yellow; I made up my own effects for all the other colors because I wanted them to be different in slex :D 12:24 LarienTelrunya: 3.6.1 has transformed another one of my reports into an EPI :P 12:24 wait, it did? 12:24 you can no longer cast spells in several polyforms, or if you're being strangled 12:25 ... not even slex would implement that, except maybe in evilvariant mode 12:25 I reported that the wording was a bit odd when reading scrolls while blind and being strangled 12:25 DT response: prevent casting spells in these cases: 12:25 + if ((mtmp == &youmonst && Strangled) 12:25 + || is_silent(mtmp->data) || !has_head(mtmp->data) 12:25 + || mtmp->data->msound == MS_BUZZ || mtmp->data->msound == MS_BURBLE) 12:25 + return FALSE; 12:26 Naturally, this doesn't apply to monsters 12:26 okay the silent or strangled I can understand, but the others... wtf?! 12:26 (despite can_chant working on both players and monsters) 12:27 seems rather arbitrary... if MS_BURBLE does not work then MS_MUMBLE realistically shouldn't either, or give a message "You try to pronounce the incantation, but all you do is mumbling incomprehensively." 12:27 rip arch-lich casting 12:28 also, how would a MS_BARK pronounce an incantation? "Wewo-wewo-wawwaw-yip-bark"? :P 12:28 woff! 12:28 :D 12:29 YANI: for Skilled casting, instead of getting stronger spell effects, you can cast it mentally 12:29 and these blocks don't matter 12:29 for Basic casting, the restrictions are harsher in polyforms (e.g. MS_BARK shouldn't work) 12:30 how can you cast underwater? 12:30 -!- raisse has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:31 how can you read scrolls underwater, or drink potions underwater? 12:31 I don't see how you wouldn't be able to drink potions underwater 12:31 but scrolls at least work if you are blind... you "cogitate the formula on it" 12:32 you mean if you can't talk 12:32 YANI: you can drink potions underwater, but it will suffer a dilution before you can drink it. For undiluted potions this is fine, for diluted ones they turn into water, and acid explodes in your face 12:33 Why would you want to drink acid in the first place? 12:33 cure stoning? 12:33 quaff-ID? 12:34 FIQ: the blessed/cursed effects of acid are another candidate for switching around 12:34 blessed acid is _more potent acid_ 12:35 cursed acid is... kind of cruddy acid 12:35 True. 12:37 YANI: whether the "weaker" acid is blessed or cursed, it does not cure stoning reliably 12:39 YASI: eating trice in a form with petrification resistance can give you intrinsic petrification resistance. This converts instapetrifications to slow-petrifications and can make slow-petrification either not have any effect or have a higher timer 12:41 Instapetrifications and delayed petrifications need to be made more consistent. 12:42 I like that one FIQ 12:42 "The chickatrice touches you!" <-- most of the time this does nothing, but how is it different from touching a chickatrice corpse? 12:42 Welp. 12:42 and even when it does do something, it's delayed. 12:42 Vlad read a cursed scroll of teleportation to get away from me. He's nowhere in his tower. 12:42 I have no idea where he ended up. 12:42 just grunthack things 12:43 sgrunt gave Vlad cursed teleport *intentionally* 12:43 aosdict: slex did something similar, except that if you manage to steal the scrolls from him and read them yourself, they do nothing :D 12:43 the trick is to kill him quickly enough so he doesn't get a chance to read them 12:44 That seems just kind of mean. 12:44 I mean now you have to chase this fucker across the entire dungeon. 12:44 Where's the challenge or fun in that? 12:44 Grunthack is the Evil Variant. 12:44 There is none, as far as I'm concerned. 12:45 [nd] Grasshopper (Kni Hum Fem Law) killed Ixoth, on T:39231 12:45 [nd] Grasshopper (Kni Hum Fem Law) acquired the Bell of Opening, on T:39232 12:45 [nd] Eleven (Mon Hum Fem Law), 509 points, T:879, killed by a gas spore's explosion 12:46 so... 12:46 lamashtu 12:46 or whatshername 12:46 let's wake her up ^_^ 12:46 uh 12:46 did you curse everythign first 12:46 well, not *everything* 12:46 rings and weapons 12:46 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed Yeenoghu, on T:34452 12:46 and ideally have an engagement ring on? 12:47 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed Juiblex, on T:34458 12:47 Tokage is on a rampage 12:47 porkman: where is lamashtu? 12:47 she seduces too? 12:48 I don't remember 12:48 but in case she summons smth that will 12:48 I'm gonna be standing on a triple gorgoneion with a scroll of scare 12:51 damnit 12:51 do I need a drum of earthquake to wake that wench up 12:51 jonadab: EPI: Master Kaen has intrinsic resistance to death and sleep rays too. Because otherwise you could snipe him like kerio did, instakilling him with a wand while he's still meditating and didn't pick up the artifact yet. 12:52 (Funnily enough, apparently 3.6.0 made it so that the eyes must be worn to become magic resistant, so a death ray will instakill him no matter what.) 12:53 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) destroyed Vlad the Impaler, on T:35212 12:53 Found the fucker. 12:53 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) picked up the Candelabrum of Invocation, on T:35215 12:53 Oh yeah, I needed to buy candles. 12:53 I never remember to buy candles until I kill Vlad. It's a hassle. 12:54 oh wow 12:54 drum of earthquake creates a LOT of r and X 12:54 Tokage: 3.6 has your back on that, at least 12:54 it guarantees some candles in the top of his tower 12:55 porkmann: went afk, am back now 12:55 That's nice. 12:55 what did you _do_ ?? 12:55 level 30 earthquake is bad 13:01 -!- bouquet has joined #hardfought 13:01 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 13:01 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse] by ChanServ 13:08 [slex] Tarrant (Alt Bre Mal Neu), 2136 points, T:1309, killed by a monster (little girl) 13:15 [slex] Tarrant (Ord Alb Mal Cha), 54 points, T:66, killed by a monster (evasive sewer rat) 13:17 @d?yochol 13:17 yochol ~1~ yochlol (&) | Lvl: 10 | Diff: 13 | Spd: 12 | Res: fire poison drain | Confers: nothing | MR: 19 | Generates: gehennom | AC: -1 | Attacks: 4d4 tentacle physical, 4d4 tentacle physical, 4d4 gaze study | Alignment: -10 | Flags: amorphous, breathless, poisonous, nopoly, demon, stalker, infravisible 13:18 Tokage: be careful with Demogorgon btw 13:18 everything up to that point is child play 13:18 I know. 13:18 and after that point too, for that matter 13:18 Fortunately I should see him coming, unless he's parked right at the bottom of the stairs. 13:19 Demo has disposed of surprisingly many people in grunt 13:19 Mandevil has a death, jonadab has a death, K2-webirc has several 13:19 so yeah 13:19 yes, good way to do it is to flee through his house until you get him out on the bridge, then blast him with fireballs and cold cones 13:19 what about water elementals? 13:20 they're dangerous but you see them coming 13:20 and they're slow 13:20 FIQ: I have a death! 13:20 o no 13:20 And I'm still mad at him 13:20 !who 13:20 ri-corpse-san: tkirby [fh] Tokage [gh] Eleven [nd] munterplant [nd] 13:20 aosdict: to demo or water elementals? 13:20 Demo 13:20 ah 13:20 !role tokage 13:20 ri-corpse-san: No variant tokage on server. 13:20 yeah 13:20 it happens 13:20 I don't have a death 13:20 !where tokage 13:20 but I came awfully close once 13:20 !role grunthack tokage 13:20 ri-corpse-san: priest 13:21 !whereis Tokage 13:21 FIQ: Tokage [gh]: (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) T:37218 Gehennom level: 40 13:21 is what you want 13:21 Tokage: I hope you picked up acid res! 13:21 > wiz 13:21 > priest 13:21 beholder you are bad 13:22 except he is a wizard 13:22 what's wrong 13:22 is what? 13:22 ri-corpse-san: !role doe snot get information about current games 13:22 ah 13:22 does not* 13:22 random one? 13:22 !role nethack 13:22 ri-corpse-san: valkyrie 13:22 !role nethack 13:22 ri-corpse-san: archeologist 13:22 ya I see 13:22 yeah 13:22 !role slex 13:22 aww... 13:22 !8ball will Tokage die to Demogorgon? 13:22 aosdict: It is decidedly so 13:22 -!- tacco| has joined #hardfought 13:22 !role slashem extended 13:22 ri-corpse-san: No variant slashem on server. 13:22 !role slashem-extended 13:22 ri-corpse-san: No variant slashem-extended on server. 13:22 LarienTelrunya: Tangles did tell you to give him a list 13:23 !race slex 13:23 and he'd add it 13:23 FIQ: I thought bug_sniper had made such a list and Elronnd also made one? 13:23 well Tangles asked you 13:24 uhh... well: bug_sniper, Elronnd: Tangles wants a list of slex roles from you now! First one to supply it wins a free wand of wishing! 13:24 Tokage: no hitpointbar? 13:24 !lotg porkman 13:24 May the Luck of the Grasshopper be with you always, porkman! 13:24 llel 13:24 -!- ri-corpse-san has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 13:26 First one to supply it wins a free wand of wishing! (Disclaimer:Freewandofwishingmaybeprovidedas(1:-7).LarienTelrunyaisnotresponsibleforthestateofthisreward.) 13:32 -!- K2-webirc has left #hardfought 13:33 Hmm. Giants will try to throw boulders at you through iron bars. 13:34 This produces a "Whang!" and drops the boulder on the space before the bars. 13:46 I only recently discovered that there's treats behind iron bars. I always assumed it was just dungeon decorations. 13:46 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed Orcus, on T:37753 13:50 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed the invisible Geryon, on T:37845 13:56 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) averted death, on T:38207 14:01 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) bribed Dispater with 632 zorkmids for safe passage, on T:38338 14:03 I think grunt would've been far better off spending his time buffing up mummies and ghouls. 14:03 Those guys I could actually see being legitimately dangerous. 14:03 With curses, and weird lovecraftian spells or something. 14:03 Zombies are only considered non-dangerous in nethack because everyone is used to them being pushovers. 14:04 Hm, is this a bug 14:04 I am permanently blind 14:04 Zombies _are_ non-dangeorus in vanilla NetHack. 14:04 Porkman: secret 3.6.0 permablindness conduct unlocked? L) 14:04 :) 14:04 dnethack 14:05 https://postimg.org/image/3pcz23vn2z/ 14:17 Ah, not-so-permanent. 14:17 Or, wait. 14:17 Why is your telepathy still active? 14:18 Demogorgon is on the other side of the door. 14:18 Time to go. 14:18 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0TzUNti3rY 14:18 Why does it still say "Blind"? 14:18 cause 14:18 no matter what I do 14:18 I remain blinded 14:18 I can cast cure blindness 100 times and it'll say "you can see again" every time 14:19 I see. 14:19 try to take off blindtools 14:19 didn't work 14:19 Hmm. 14:19 Tokage: This is where Demogorgon is btw 14:19 He knows Stone to Flesh. So the initial plan of bashing him with a cockatrice corpse didn't work. 14:19 indeed 14:19 Guess I'll try fireball. 14:20 Resists. 14:20 pretty sure he's fire resistant 14:20 but not cold resistant 14:20 but spamming cone of cold will just make him escape downstairs 14:20 ah, helpful that he's there 14:20 so he can't flee 14:21 He's fleeing, even though I'm pretty sure I haven't dealt any damage at him. 14:21 Tokage: why no use_inverse? 14:21 for better hitpointbar 14:21 it's not like you use detect monsters anyway 14:21 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed Demogorgon, on T:38961 14:21 rip 14:21 Cone of Cold bit to him. 14:21 yeah 14:21 he's not cold resistant 14:21 but you don't want to cast cone of cold when he is at > since he tends to flee downstairs 14:21 Guess that's his achilles heel. 14:22 putting you at a bad spot 14:22 but he moved away from it 14:22 so gg 14:22 lol 14:23 A nalfeshnee also knew Stone to Flesh, but other than that there's now a nice big demon rock garden in Demogorgon's castle. 14:23 heh 14:24 [slex] AmyBSOD (Gof Ske Fem Cha), 27 points, T:133, killed by a monster (flying moyatto ball called swarming swing bundle wearing high heels) 14:24 grats Tokage 14:24 pretty sure demo is the last floor before VS 14:24 have fun finding it! 14:24 Yeah, no more stairs down. 14:24 Would someone be able to please reset my game to an earlier save? 14:24 Looks like it'll be less unfun than in the maze, though. 14:24 I'mma take a shower first. 14:24 cause, unfixable permablindness is... 14:25 Porkman: only when things crash is that done 14:25 [fh] TKirby (tkirby) (Mon Hum Fem Cha), 47566 points, T:8005, killed by a crocodile 14:25 interesting death 14:26 or... fix my blindness somehow? :p 14:26 Porkman: try taking off blindtools 14:26 just a tip 14:26 I'm not wearing any 14:26 are you sure 14:27 yes 14:27 and you aren't standing in some form of stinking cloud? 14:27 remember that dnh has more blindtools 14:27 nope 14:27 have a look :) 14:27 none of this is a blindtool 14:27 I don't see you in spec menu 14:27 !who 14:27 FIQ: tkirby [fh] Tokage [gh] Raisse [nd] munterplant [nd] Eleven [nd] 14:28 oh, i'm on ascension.run 14:28 ah 14:28 -!- K2-webirc has joined #hardfought 14:28 -!- K2-webirc has quit [Client Quit] 14:28 check ttyrec? 14:28 -!- K2-webirc has joined #hardfought 14:29 try polymorphing into something 14:29 also if you are a drow 14:29 that might explain things too 14:29 @d?orc of the age of stars 14:29 No such monster. 14:29 try to poly into this 14:29 whatever the spelling is 14:30 I'm an incantifier 14:31 ah 14:31 orc of the age of stars? 14:31 kerio, the server admin, is in #ascension.run 14:31 however, he can sometimes be a bit unrealible with help 14:31 orc of the ages of stars 14:36 -!- K2-webirc has left #hardfought 14:37 [fh] TKirby (tkirby) (Wiz Elf Fem Cha), 27502 points, T:1749, killed by a gas spore's explosion 14:38 -!- tkirby has joined #hardfought 14:39 -!- tkirby has quit [Client Quit] 14:40 -!- raisse has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:44 [nd] Eleven (Mon Hum Fem Law), 2736 points, T:4177, killed by a soldier ant 14:50 Nope, still a couple levels to go. 14:50 [fh] TKirby (tkirby) (Wiz Elf Fem Cha), 36395 points, T:3071, killed by a blue jelly 15:03 DIED: Luxidream (Hea-Gno-Fem-Neu), 218582 points, killed by a spotted jelly on hardfought 15:04 My toughest foe so far, possibly even counting Demogorgon: a balrog with a bullwhip of reflection. 15:04 He wouldn't give a shit about magic missiles, and flicked my magicbane straight into lava. 15:05 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 15:05 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse] by ChanServ 15:05 Hmm, could you get it back out though? 15:05 EPI: Demogorgon is guaranteed to appear with a bullwhip of reflection. All the other demon lords too. 15:07 Huh. Well, I knew he was magic resistant anyway and didn't even bother trying. 15:07 And yeah, I got it back. I froze the lava and dug down. 15:08 Also, candelabrum still needs only seven candles, right? 15:09 I wouldn't put it past grunt to make it need -eight- now, just to be a dick. 15:09 "Whoops, you only had seven. Better go back to minetown for one more - no, make it eight more, since those first seven are now partially used and therefore ruined. Have fun with Rodney on the way." 15:09 EPI: candles don't generate randomly, Izchak has always less than you need, and they cannot be wished for. Good luck getting enough to win the game. 15:10 Tokage: You could just have killed it with cone of cold, no? 15:10 [nd] Raisse (Arc Dwa Fem Law) had Sunsword bestowed upon her by Quetzalcoatl, on T:4810 15:10 That's how I did kill it. 15:11 Ah 15:11 But only after my first choice - Magic Missile - had been neutralized. 15:13 ++ 15:14 LarienTelrunya: if we had a crafting system, tallow candles should be relatively easy to make 15:14 would every character be able to craft stuff? 15:15 Each race and role is able to craft different things. 15:39 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:41027 15:40 -!- bouquet has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:41 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) picked up the Book of the Dead, on T:41031 15:44 -!- raisse is now known as raisse_away 15:44 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) performed the Invocation, on T:41254 15:45 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:41259 15:45 -!- raisse_away is now known as raisse 15:53 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed the elven high priestess of Moloch, on T:41404 15:53 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) picked up the Amulet of Yendor, on T:41406 15:54 LarienTelrunya: you are evil 15:54 :D 15:54 so, how do I access hardfought's server 15:54 since my game on ascension.run got ruined by a bug? 15:54 by the way, I absolutely love it if people who want to say "Amy your game is evil" call me a harlot :D 15:54 ssh to nethack@hardfought.org 15:55 Thank you, you evil, evil harlot. 15:55 You're not a harlot. Harlots make money when they corrupt people. 15:55 or you can also use their web terminal at https://www.hardfought.org/nethack/hterm/ 15:56 Porkman: you're welcome :) 15:57 also sorry to hear about your savegame corruption :( 15:57 YASI: if you play the harlot role, your quest leader wants you to star in a snuff flick. As the victim. You have to find a way to fake your death in order to get permission to go on the quest. (Being life saved works, but only if he sees it happen.) 15:58 :D 15:59 -!- Jendic has joined #hardfought 16:00 I knew it, you know. 16:00 I knew that I couldn't clear Demogorgon's castle without being teleported back. 16:00 SLEX is like playing dungeons and dragons with paper and dyce, and you start a whole campaign in which your lvl 36 wizard is one step away from achieving immortality, and not only does he get killed by a bunch of wandering orcs, he also gets gangraped by them first because the dungeon master's a sadistic dick. 16:00 Porkman: did you actually play it yet, or is that just what you imagine the gameplay to be like? 16:01 if I remember right I did once, and then found lava in corridors and other stuff that put me off it :p 16:02 Lol... Luxidreams death: 16:02 You kill it! 16:02 You are splashed! 16:02 You die... 16:03 Porkman: We're all still waiting to see someone besides the main developer ascend it. 16:03 do you really want me to do it 16:03 Think of the bragging rights! 16:03 fine 16:03 what's a good ssh server 16:03 (I actually don't care, really.) 16:03 play on hardfought 16:03 too late 16:03 hardfought is good if you're in NOrth AMerica. 16:04 europe 16:04 -!- raisse has quit [Read error: No route to host] 16:04 but ok 16:04 NOAM? What sort of hidden message is that? 16:04 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 16:04 oh well, if you're in europe then slashem@slashem.me is better I guess 16:04 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse] by ChanServ 16:04 If you want Europe, you're looking at em.slashem.me 16:05 em.slashem.me is running version 2.0.0 currently, while hardfought has 2.0.9 16:05 does latency even matter that much? this isn't counterstrike, after all 16:06 it's annoying if your keystrokes don't seem to register as fast as your fingers type 16:07 Anything up to about half a second is fine. Much more than that gets real noticeable. 16:07 When it hits 2+ seconds, it's _very_ annoying. 16:07 The good news is you hardly need any bandwidth at all. 16:07 Porkman: ah you're on hardfought :) 16:07 poor Tangles 16:08 US-Europe should only add 50ms or so, at most 16:08 aosdict: I heard a rumor someone is thinking about setting up an AU server. 16:08 when I'm lucky, my europe-to-hdf ping is about 150 ms 16:08 Tangles, or someone else? 16:08 Might've been him. 16:09 Porkman: for reference, if you want a good template options file, here's mine: https://em.slashem.me/userdata/Bluescreen/slex/Bluescreen.slexrc 16:09 in order to turn on the number pad, add OPTIONS=number_pad:2 16:10 number_pad is for people whose keyboards don't have hjklyubn keys. 16:10 or those who didn't grow up with vi 16:11 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:42380 16:11 vi is so confusing 16:11 jonadab: haha, that's qdb worthy 16:12 * jonadab doesn't vi at all, but uses hjkl/yubn fo rNetHack. 16:12 *for 16:12 * aosdict adds it 16:12 LarienTelrunya: I don't use vi 16:12 a solid decade of FPS games has engraved WASD into my brain 16:13 I do use vikeys 16:13 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:42516 16:13 I mean, don't use *vi* if you can use vim. 16:14 if the DevTeam ever lets us rebind keys, three guesses what I'm going to do with it 16:14 huh, why learn vikeys for nethack if you can just use the number pad? 16:14 LarienTelrunya: What if you don't have one? 16:14 Jendic: this should be either possible or planned in 3.6.1 16:15 then you buy a keyboard that has one I guess? 16:15 Sounds extremely elegant... I will carry a laptop and a keyboard (that's bigger than the laptop). 16:15 Jendic: Doesn't 3.6 already have key rebinding? 16:15 I only have a laptop. I don't want to carry around a USB keyboard too. 16:16 jonadab: Doesn't 3.4.3 have it? 16:16 But laptop keyboards are so horrid. I would slit my wrists or something if I had to use one all the time. 16:16 jonadab: Or was that a NAO patch? 16:16 3.4.3-nao probably has it. 16:16 jonadab: I agree. 16:16 Mandevil: 3.4.3 definitely did not have it; NAO might've, not sure. 16:16 jonadab: I hate laptops in general. 16:16 ^ Yes. 16:16 I mean, the portability has its uses at times. 16:17 jonadab: If it does, I have seen zero documentation of it 16:17 It definitely has. 16:17 But they're worse in every other way. 16:17 -!- bouquet has joined #hardfought 16:17 But nothing is as comfortable as full size keyboard. 16:17 ^ 16:17 Well, part of the hate is that the company issue notebook is crap. 16:17 Also, full size screen(s). 16:17 With TN display. 16:17 That just sux. 16:17 Also, a real pointing device, darnit. 16:17 jonadab: Mouse is rather portable. 16:17 jonadab: So I just carry one. 16:17 laptops have reached the point of "good enough" for many things now 16:18 jonadab: I live in a tiny apartment and don't have the space for a desktop, let alone a desk to put it on. 16:18 Mandevil: That helps a bit. 16:18 Mandevil: It helps even more if the laptop can be set to disable the built-in pointing device when the real mouse is plugged int. 16:18 aosdict: Sure, that's a good reason. 16:18 *in 16:18 Which some can. 16:18 even the real elitist gamers don't automatically sneer at you for using a laptop anymore 16:18 aosdict: Ah, Tokyo efficiency appartment, say no more. 16:19 which is saying quite a bit 16:19 Jendic: play NH4/4k/FIQHack 16:19 (allthough I do not recommend playing 4k on hardfought right now unless you don't really care about current HP) 16:19 Playing roguelikes on laptop is very very uncomfortable for me. 16:19 it has key remapping 16:19 Jendic: Gamers put up with _all kinds_ of junk. I mean, at least half of them run MS WIndows all the time. 16:19 I really tried to get used to vikeys. 16:19 But it doesn't work for me. 16:19 might be relevant: I got a system76 laptop since I use fedora. It's nice to have support that knows how to modify grub to fix a buggy touchpad. 16:20 lol. this message was stolen from ADOM 16:20 Mandevil: That's not my problem; I'm used to hjklyubn; but I typo too much on a laptop keyboard, because the keys are too small and close together and arranged _just slightly_ differently from a standard keyboard. 16:20 It would be possible to get used to that last thing, of course. 16:21 If you always use the same one. 16:21 Heaven help you when it dies and you have to replace it, though. 16:21 Dunno, I'm never comfortable on laptop-style keyboard. 16:22 I can use it, but it's always strictly worse experience than full-travel keyboard. 16:22 Or whatever is the term in English. 16:23 BTW, I have an old IBM keyboard. 16:23 Wonder what will I do when it finally fails. 16:23 hmm 16:23 there's a company that makes custom keyboards 16:24 now since NH3.6 does support the "escape" version of alt+stuff 16:24 with "altmeta" 16:24 I want Das Keyboard. 16:24 there is no reason it can't support arrow key movement 16:24 But it's fairly expensive. 16:24 And gf thinks I'm mad. 16:24 Mandevil: If it's a model M, it probably won't fail in your lifetime. 16:24 Unless something happens to the cord. 16:24 Nah, it's newer PS/2 one. 16:25 Ah. 16:25 WASD keyboards, they're really very good 16:25 you can have several standard configurations and any custom keys you need 16:25 What I want is a keyboard that has multiple keys for each thumb and is fully remappable (including the buckies). 16:25 jonadab: laptop keybaords where ctrl isn't on bottom left is hell 16:25 I don't care how the keytops are labeled, if at all. 16:25 raisse: They look good. 16:26 raisse: Not cheap either, though. 16:26 spouse has one 16:26 they have enough travel for people who are used to a proper keyboard 16:26 jonadab: you know xmodmap can remap stuff, right 16:26 FIQ: My preference is for Ctrl to be on the right-pinkie home position (and shift on the left pinkie home), on a keyboard that only has one spacebar for both thumbs. Even better would be thumb buckies. 16:27 FIQ: Yes, in theory. I should look into it. 16:27 what is thumb buckies 16:27 Bucky keys you can hit with your thumbs,? 16:27 ??? 16:28 is my non-nativity of English failing me 16:28 You know, like if you had shift and alt under the left thumb, ctrl and one other (system maybe) under the right thumb, space bar sort of above/between the middle two. 16:28 You do know what a thumb is, yes? 16:28 As in, the opposable finger? 16:28 yes 16:29 but not bucky 16:29 Oh. That's old IT jargon. 16:29 FOr a key that doesn't do anything by itself, but changes what other keys do when held. 16:29 ah 16:29 I think it originated at MIT. 16:29 modifier keys 16:29 Or possibly Stanford. 16:30 Modifier keys, yes, I think that's what MS calls them. 16:30 I've also seen them called "shifting keys", but that is a bit confusing since "shift" is a specific one also. 16:31 It would make sense to call them "hold-down keys", but if anyone does, I'm not aware of it. 16:34 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) averted death, on T:43685 16:34 Vorpal blade, fucker! 16:35 Sheesh. No more life saving amulets, unless I start to spend wishes on them... yeah, sure why not. 16:35 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) wished for "blessed amulet of life saving", on T:43694 16:35 eh 16:36 doppelgangers have a number of free polymorphs left? 16:36 SLEX is no longer the easily ascendable game that SLASH'EM is. 16:37 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:43739 16:37 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) entered the planes, on T:43796 16:37 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:43797 16:38 do those regenerate? or is that it for the whole game? 16:39 they regenerate slowly, one more polymorph every 5000 turns (the total can also go over 10) 16:40 -!- raisse has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:47 a condom? hah 16:48 it prevents you from contracting STDs when consorting with foocubi 16:48 wtf, there are STDs in slex? 16:48 of course! 16:48 the answer to "there are X in slex?" is almost always yes 16:48 and shk no longer have services? 16:49 they do, but they're no longer guaranteed 16:50 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:44089 16:52 Are there foocubus shopkeepers who offer "services" for a fee, If You Know What I Mean? 16:52 heh, unfortunately not 16:53 Isn't that what all foocubi are? 16:55 also 16:55 why is it that every pile of gold only has 1 gold or so 16:56 sometimes, when the game would make an item, it will make a gold piece instead to cut down on the huge amount of loot you get 16:56 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed Death, on T:44162 16:56 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed Death, on T:44174 16:58 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha) killed Death, on T:44192 16:58 I haven't even touched Death. 16:58 I just like conflict. 16:59 lol, just got punished out of nowhere 16:59 welcome to slex :) 16:59 Right on first try! 17:00 [nd] Eleven (Sam Hum Fem Law), 1290 points, T:2926, killed by a Mordor orc 17:00 [gh] Tokage (Wiz Kob Mal Cha), 2834386 points, T:44204, ascended https://www.hardfought.org/userdata/T/Tokage/gh/dumplog/1508452277.gh.txt 17:00 Tokage: wow, congratulations! you didn't need many attempts at all to beat the evil variant! 17:00 * LarienTelrunya still has not ascended grunt yet 17:00 It's not that evil really. 17:01 -!- ri-corpse-san has joined #hardfought 17:01 It ditches the weird sticky teleportation thing so even Demogorgon can be blasted away from a distance, and the whole cancellation effect was greatly overhyped: I just lost Magicbane's enchantments a couple times, a bit from my gauntlets, and a wand of death got trained. 17:01 drained* 17:01 what, grunt nerfed the covetous AI??? I'd expect Grunt of all things to boost that 17:02 I don't know if it's been nerfed - it was rare anyone could steal from me even in vanilla. 17:03 well covetous AI is what controls the "warp to player to attack, and then the upstair to heal" routine of Demogorgon and similar bosses 17:03 porkman: did you report the bug to kerio? (I read transcript) 17:03 Ah. 17:03 grats Tokage! 17:04 no 17:04 I can't get a hold of kerio 17:04 Early game's pretty tough, what with the higher damage, the reduced unicorn spawns, and of course the fucking zombies - but once I get on a roll I'm about as unstoppable as in vanilla, maybe barring Demogorgon. 17:05 Hmm. Maybe there's an argument that Grunt takes the already very early-game-skewed difficulty curve and skews it even further. 17:05 so, where would I find a list of things in slex 17:05 like, items, monsters, etc 17:05 Tokage: wow, you seem to be a very good player, you might want to attempt some of the other more difficult variants ;) 17:06 Porkman: your best bet is the source; the monsters page in particular was so big that it crashed the wiki, so it had to be rolled back 17:06 I don't think I'm that good. I die a lot. 17:06 You'll notice this one went down three times. 17:06 I can't read code 17:06 github won't show monst.c because it's too large 17:07 aosdict: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/SLASHEM-Extended/SLASHEM-Extended/master/src/monst.c works for me 17:07 that freezes my chrome 17:07 Oh, it'll show it _raw_. 17:07 Porkman: you don't necessarily need to understand the code itself; objects.c and artilist.h, for example, list the various items and artifacts in the game 17:08 Too large for just browsing the directory tree though. 17:08 porkman: this is barely code, it's basically a set of numbers 17:08 well, it's definitely cryptic code, but not a programming language 17:08 and the end of invent.c has information about the items 17:08 oh, Porkman: do you know about inventory item descriptions? hit the corresponding letter of an item in main inventory view to get a description 17:08 that is so helpful ^ 17:09 * aosdict is campaigning to make the objects and monsters lists in yaml or some other language 17:09 that will then compile into C 17:09 larien: what role should I try next? :D 17:09 goldminer? 17:09 ri-corpse-san: oh you're playing too? one moment 17:10 gonna try to 17:10 the goldminer starts with a pick-axe and some crappy equipment and is generally not a very strong role 17:11 kek 17:11 kurwa sounds cool 17:11 how about a rocker? they're very good with the sling and also know force bolt, plus they get a pick-axe 17:11 kurwa is fun too :D 17:11 tha'ts the slow n stoning resistant one 17:11 rihgt? 17:11 yeah 17:12 also, what does the demon/devil race get? 17:12 help please 17:12 why cant I see anything 17:12 do they start with -alignment 17:12 hmm, on my screen everything is displayed 17:12 where do you get the time to even, like, think of all those monster names, Amy? 17:12 try ctrl-R maybe? 17:12 o no 17:12 it's just my pet 17:13 >_> ditching it 17:13 Porkman: some people (e.g. my roommate) say I got too much time on my hands ;) 17:13 kek 17:13 ri-corpse-san: as long as you wear the eerie cloak, all monsters are generated invisible 17:13 o 17:13 >_> 17:14 what the fuck 17:14 this equp 17:14 > -25 17:14 O_O 17:14 fleecy-colored inventory :) 17:14 nice 17:14 the colors are re-randomized every time you open it 17:14 YANI: gnomes get a permanent limited radius 3 detection of gold and gems 17:15 what is giving these msgs 17:15 which ones? the garbled strings come from the red spell heels, and the your momma messages come from the momhat 17:16 _sigh_ 17:16 are they garbling actual ones? 17:16 by the way, the kurwa can #chat to intelligent monsters for sex, which allows you to get rid of the cursed crap 17:16 or just spamming nonsense 17:16 oh 17:16 uh 17:16 hm 17:16 some garbled messages are extra ones, some others replace actual ones 17:17 > oh my god, take all this money 17:17 gee thanks am I that ugly 17:17 heh, you're a kurwa, monsters pay you for sex instead of the other way around 17:17 heh 17:17 what's the boss companion scroll do? 17:17 summons a tame boss monster :D 17:18 who wants to bet it always summons Moldoux, the Defenceless Mold 17:18 actually it's random, but it depends on the current level difficulty 17:18 huh 17:18 so is it godo 17:18 good 17:19 generally? 17:19 i.e. you probably won't get a tame Jubilex on dlvl2, but you might get some other companion 17:19 but I'll want to wait until I get to a lower level 17:19 ooh 17:19 I was thiking stupid ones 17:19 like pero pero 17:19 >_> 17:19 yeah Pero Pero is also possible (everything that's G_UNIQ, basically, with very few exceptions) 17:20 like? :D 17:20 quest leader and nemesis I assume 17:20 and maybe the high priest 17:20 Rodney is also impossible 17:20 i.e. everything that can be randomly generated is eligible 17:20 cool 17:20 and this is slex, Jubilex and other demon lords and also Medusa can be randomly generated 17:20 >_< 17:21 demo? 17:21 sure 17:21 is that good 17:21 by the way, usually I wear the red spell heels as a kurwa, since they give a lot of AC and are high-heeled 17:21 winter's bite 17:21 ah 17:21 conical hat 17:22 woah that AC 17:22 winter's bite is a fake artifact 17:22 9? 17:22 and lol 17:22 red spell heels are base 8 AC, 5 MC 17:22 and you have the body armor skill so they're probably worth 9 AC total 17:23 cool :D 17:23 wha'ts a speedbug stone do? 17:23 and covetous stone? 17:23 fleece I get >_> 17:23 are the descriptions not good enough? speedbug randomizes your speed, covetous stone makes the covetous AI of e.g. Demogorgon smarter 17:24 no I'm just not smart and I forgot 17:24 I won't pester you more >_> 17:24 slowing down spider net 17:24 wth 17:24 ri-corpse-san: it's okay, feel free to ask away :) sometimes the descriptions are a bit inaccurate, I admit 17:24 well 17:24 that is definitely the case if I haven't checked them yet :) 17:25 porkman: "wth" doesn't ever do justice to SLEX 17:25 Porkman: that polearm is a fake artifact; those are items that aren't really artifacts, but they're often highly enchanted. Not necessarily *positively* enchanted. Check them for curses first! :D 17:25 larien:..... can i use the kurwa sex on an anthro shoe 17:26 ri-corpse-san: should work :) 17:26 >_< 17:26 also, is there an item I have that causes this map weirdness? 17:26 i.e. levels have no walls, just rock, and levels have rain clouds not rock 17:26 nope, for a kurwa all walls become invisible at XL4 17:26 the rain clouds are randomly generated 17:27 DIED: bouquet (Arc-Hum-Fem-Neu), 2150 points, killed by a homunculus, while sleeping on altorg 17:27 huh 17:27 tha'ts cool I guess 17:27 and they're invis but still there? 17:27 what surprises me is that I am still alive 17:27 !whereis porkman 17:27 ri-corpse-san: porkman [slex]: No details available 17:27 what role/race? 17:28 Porkman: you already did Minetown too, right? 17:28 -!- Tokage has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:29 kind of 17:29 there wasn't anything interesting 17:29 and a locked shop I can't access 17:29 not bad for your first attempt :) 17:30 is that a legit thing >_> 17:30 trap that stops me from having poison resis 17:30 yeah 17:30 forever? 17:30 o_o 17:30 nope, it times out; as long as the effect is active, you simply cannot have the intrinsic that got disabled 17:30 it times out _phew_ 17:30 but when it times out, the intrinsic comes back online if you had it 17:31 ah ok 17:32 can kurwas never get good sex effects? 17:32 -!- bouquet has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.93 [Firefox 56.0/20171006080225]] 17:32 they can; slex makes it much less likely in general 17:32 ah ok 17:32 19 is only a 50/50 shot in vanilla but still 17:32 ugh 17:32 in vanilla you can eventually get 100% success though; not so in slex 17:33 cool 17:33 makes sense I guess 17:33 kurwas would be OP :P 17:33 hold up, if I get a humanoid boss pet can i use it for portable sex? 17:33 that feel when a relative who's Good With Computers calls you in to help troubleshoot something 17:33 what is it? 17:33 ri-corpse-san: sure :) 17:34 ;D 17:34 also, in order to get a positive result from sex, a d135 is rolled and if it's lower than (INT + CHA), the result will be positive for you 17:34 > 125 17:34 *125 17:34 *135 17:34 ok that's a whole lot different 17:35 so how do you know if something is a real or a fake artifact 17:35 you don't 17:35 shops sell it for cheap 17:36 and there's a list in the source 17:36 oh, you do, by examining the item description 17:36 what 17:36 lol 17:36 however that only works if the item is identified (or of a type that doesn't need to be identified) 17:36 cool 17:36 d135? 17:36 Porkman: a 135-sided dice 17:36 that means that 17:36 msot of the time you have sex, you get fucked 17:36 DIED: dgoddard (Mon-Hum-Mal-Neu), 4519 points, killed by a killer bee, while frozen by a monster's gaze on hardfought 17:37 hahahahahahaha :D 17:37 team a/team e double whammy! 17:38 Porkman: the red # are tunnels; as long as you don't fly, you should be able to move through them 17:39 you don't fly? huh 17:39 why don't I have any gold 17:40 fountain? 17:40 or somebody stole it 17:40 no no i mean 17:40 Porkman: looks to me like you have 139 $ 17:40 all the gold I found 17:40 amounts to 139 17:40 gotta clear some vaults or leprechaun halls :D 17:40 wot? I just lost the fleece stone 17:40 I liked htat >_> 17:40 aww 17:40 did someone steal it? 17:41 no clue 17:41 not sure what else I lost 17:43 Porkman: gratz on the shopkeeper kill :) 17:44 my old man refuses to shut up about the superiority of Linux over Windows, and yet here I am burning a recovery disc so he can reinstall Ubuntu 17:44 ah 17:44 item teleporter larien 17:44 fleece stone is here :P 17:44 ah :D 17:45 hmmm 17:45 why does it prompt me twice to kill a watchman 17:45 are they mega super buffed? 17:46 ah, no, I just wanted to make sure that those who use vikeys don't accidentally anger monsters when walking northwest 17:46 the watchmen are like the vanilla ones, so you can probably steamroller them now 17:46 also, how do I wear stuff that's got a # as a symbol? 17:46 > wish parser wand 17:47 you should use a container; if you have more than 52 items in open inventory, additional ones all become # and are difficult to select 17:47 slex characters have enough carry capacity to use a box or chest as a portable container :) 17:49 it can help to use , to select everything on the current page, or e.g. % to select all food 17:49 what do slex hand blasters do? 17:50 they fire blaster bolts and laser beams 17:50 congrats Tokage 17:50 K2: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-20 07:54 EDT: +Beholder │ K2: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-19 10:19 EDT: FIQHack updated 17:50 brand new to grunthack and ascends that quickly, no E word also 17:50 pretty good 17:51 ok party time, bbl 17:51 have fun 17:51 * K2 will 17:52 Porkman: you can drop and pick up items without using up turns in slex, so repeatedly dropping all the # items and picking them back up should set them to actual letters :) 17:52 uh, how 17:52 d# 17:52 @l?franzi 17:52 No such monster. 17:52 can also #adjust and then pick # to set one of the # items to a different letter 17:52 @s?franzi 17:52 No such monster. 17:52 @x?franzi 17:52 it's @le 17:52 @le?franzi 17:52 Franzi (b) | Lvl: 5 | Diff: 11 | Spd: 9 | Res: cold sleep disintegrate petrification | Confers: cold sleep | MR: 9 | Generates: unique | AC: 9 | Attacks: 1d4 weapon physical, 3d4 kick physical, 2d3 breath cold | Alignment: 9 | Flags: omnivore, swims, amphibious, nopoly, stalker, vegan 17:53 worth keeping I guess (boss) 17:53 oh she's on your side? yay! 17:53 she wears super-cute wedge sandals ♥ 17:53 well shit 17:53 I have STDs now 17:53 STD get :D 17:53 hunger 17:54 yeah, that is intrinsic hunger, so you need to eat more often 17:54 is gravenspine a real arti? 17:54 nope 17:54 > watchman egg 17:54 o shit 17:54 lol the watchman got pregnant? :P 17:55 also, monsters with claw attacks will chain-paralyze the kurwa and are thus VERY dangerous 17:55 great now I'm sick 17:55 they're currently so strong that they're overpowered, so I nerfed them in the development version because kurwas would just die too quickly to them 17:55 wot 17:56 :D 17:56 what is that 17:56 good luck remembering what was where! 17:56 what 17:56 at XL8, kurwas get the grayout interface screw, which is what you're seeing now 17:56 [nd] Eleven (Sam Hum Fem Law), 800 points, T:1711, killed by a wand 17:57 what, this altar vanished? 17:57 vanishing altars? seriously? 17:57 altars can vanish in slex 17:57 this is so dumb 17:57 ri-corpse-san: are you on a quest to get all the STDs? 17:57 yes actually 17:57 I want to try a different role ;P 17:57 and not gonna quit 17:57 cuz tha'ts cheap 17:57 shall I end you? 17:57 go leave some good bones for me 17:58 I mean, after all you're in GM mode :D 17:58 haha yeah. nice try, tempting people with GM mode 17:58 *as if I were going to... trust you...* 17:58 ri-corpse-san: do you want to get killed by me? 17:58 Porkman: GM mode is an actual thing in slex, ri-corpse-san is using it 17:58 I know 17:58 but 17:58 larien: sure ;P 17:58 I know it's a thing 17:59 summon demogorgon plz 17:59 but... I also know it's not a *good* thing! 17:59 I'm serious 17:59 leave a nasty bones 17:59 :/ tha'ts not demo 17:59 yeah but they're powerful enough to own you anyway 17:59 welp I'm ill again RIP me 18:00 no 18:00 summon demo 18:00 can't pray? 18:00 I need to posthumously kill porkman 18:00 larien: already did for ill iirc 18:00 oh my god lol 18:00 no no no no no 18:00 okay, here, have some demon lords :D 18:00 go away 18:00 haha 18:00 heh 18:01 [slex] rikersan (Kur Ang Mal Cha), 9707 points, T:2775, killed by a monster (Lamashtu) 18:01 who needs deathly illnesses 18:01 wtf 18:01 lamashtu, dagon, and demo are there iirc 18:01 Lamashtu fucked up my previous game with bugged blinding 18:01 oh really? thatw as her? 18:01 RIP 18:01 i swear if I find lamashtu bones I'm going to... 18:01 well, at least in slex she doesn't have any blindness attacks (bugged or otherwise) 18:02 @le?lamashtu 18:02 Lamashtu (&) | Lvl: 105 | Diff: 75 | Spd: 24 | Res: fire disintegrate poison acid petrification drain | Confers: nothing | MR: 95 | Generates: unique | AC: -26 | Attacks: 3d7 bite vampire-drain, 3d7 touch steal-by-teleportation, 3d7 touch abduction, 3d7 cast clerical, 3d7 cast clerical | Alignment: -20 | Flags: flies, seeinvis, poisonous, nopoly, demon, stalker, covetous, infravisible 18:02 abduction lol 18:02 RIP you 18:02 trying agian in a minute 18:03 larien: what's the devil race got again? 18:03 fire and poison resistance 18:03 ah cool 18:03 I'll try that 18:03 not as OP as angel but fun 18:03 and also infravision, apparently 18:03 so 18:04 about ubuntu 18:04 once you burn the .iso to disc, you just drop it in the tray and install from the disc, right? 18:04 or has my old man gone and done something wrong? 18:05 larien: will play slex later 18:05 TF2 just updated 18:05 ah, I see 18:06 cross aligned altars didn't like you putting crap on them, if I remember right? 18:06 in slex? 18:06 huh 18:06 in slashem in general 18:06 you can drop stuff on them to determine BUC; you just can't convert them or the priest will get mad 18:06 hm 18:06 o come on you can't hybrid angel and devil? 18:06 don't they go "get your junk off my altar?" 18:06 dangit am 18:06 amy 18:06 temple altars can also disappear, but that happens a lot less often than other altars 18:06 ri-corpse-san: well yeah, those aren't eligible as hybrid races 18:07 :( 18:07 oh 18:07 so this is a real artifact 18:08 which? 18:08 windrider, incredible sweetness 18:08 windrider? 18:08 that's a cool one 18:08 :D it's in dnethack too 18:08 no boomerang skill 18:09 :/ 18:09 use it anyway :P 18:10 lol 18:11 enlightenment talks crap 18:12 incredible sweetness gives half physical damage or something 18:16 hmm 18:16 worth losing innate AC for...maybe 18:16 do you have a list of artifacts? 18:16 well, https://raw.githubusercontent.com/SLASHEM-Extended/SLASHEM-Extended/master/include/artilist.h 18:18 > * initialized to always be a birthcloth; if you have children while wearing it, you instantly die of complications. */ 18:18 incredible sweetness is a randart, which means that its base item type is randomized per game (but is always a body armor) 18:18 what 18:18 > arabella's sexy girl butt 18:18 well, the player can become pregnant from foocubus encounters 18:18 and you can impregnate them :p 18:18 lol, there's a one about junethack 2016 18:19 what is a traffic light? it's in teh artilist 18:19 a polearm 18:19 cool 18:27 -!- greqrg has joined #hardfought 18:28 22 frag grenades... 18:29 throwing them at a monster will cause explosions that don't deal much damage but can hit many monsters at once 18:29 (SPFX_RESTR|SPFX_HPHDAM) 18:29 yeah, they exist in slashem 18:30 wait, they're a real artifact? 18:30 you could stack them together, arm them, and they will all go boom one after the other... if you are fast enough 18:30 no, that's incredible sweetness 18:30 ah 18:30 ...whatever the meaning of it 18:30 SPFX_RESTR means that you cannot name the artifact (appears on almost every single one), and SPFX_HPHDAM means it conveys half physical damage 18:30 https://raw.githubusercontent.com/SLASHEM-Extended/SLASHEM-Extended/master/include/artifact.h explains what the different flags are 18:31 oh hmm 18:35 in slex, protection always costs 4000 zorkmids; good thing you weren't level 9! 18:38 I have plans to make protection cost scale with the number of points of protection you've already received. (The priest suggests an amount, so you don't have to keep track.) 18:38 larien: does rmv curse remove punishment in slex? 18:38 I know opening doesn't 18:39 what? it does!!! you must zap the chain with it 18:39 huh 18:39 I tried a bunch a while ago 18:39 didn't work 18:39 jonadab: IMHO anything is better than the vanilla system ;) 18:39 I checked the source and it showed that it was changed from vanilla so 18:39 it was a wand if that matters 18:39 ri-corpse-san: Maybe the RNG decreed that opening doesn't work in your game ;-) 18:39 -.- 18:39 I honestly wouldn't be suprised 18:39 works for me 18:40 ri-corpse-san: Maybe you need higher wand skill. LarienTelrunya totally ported wand skill to slex, right? 18:40 I don't think so 18:40 nope, slex has a "device" skill, which works completely differently 18:40 huh, I must have been unlucky 18:40 or smth 18:40 I don't know 18:40 I remember it giving a msg 18:41 really? zapping the chain normally gives no message at all 18:41 ri-corpse-san: Just get an island nymph to steal the ball and chain :-) 18:41 but still unpunishs you and destroys the chain :D 18:41 oh, found it 18:41 "your chain quivers for a moment" 18:41 must have shot myself instead of the chain 18:41 Oh, I've seen that message. In the source, I think. 18:41 ya i found it there 18:41 zap.c 18:41 Maybe it happens when you zap the ball? 18:41 Not sure. 18:41 I was carrying the ball 18:41 Ah. 18:41 looks like it was myself 18:42 based on other surrounding spells/effects 18:42 yeah, you zapped yourself 18:42 mainly the one under that says 18:42 "pline(..."Bilge! Ye've shot yerself! 18:42 >_> 18:42 and huh ok 18:42 just I was dumb then lel 18:44 RIP porkman 18:45 oh, kops Your limit for ascension was at turn 67184 18:45 what, you have a limit for ascension? 18:45 that's rather low 18:45 ^ never got that 18:45 it can be higher 18:45 Porkman: yes; if you exceed it, random bad stuff starts happening, and gets worse the longer you procrastinate 18:46 no infinite farming :P 18:46 wait I thought it was limit before you could ascend huh 18:46 and what kind of bad stuff? 18:46 amy starts genesis'ing multiple lamashtus? 18:47 huh, no shotguns? 18:47 well, it periodically triggers the "bad effect" function that can do all kinds of stuff including status effects, destroy your items etc. 18:47 ah I see 18:47 ofc slex has a function for that 18:47 badeffect() function in potion.c 18:47 :D 18:47 in potion, not trap? huh 18:47 it can paralyze you, steal your intrinsics, teleport you, etc. etc. lots of things can happen 18:48 I discovered the book of the dead?! 18:48 wizards know all books from the beginning 18:48 yes 18:48 now you'll see all of slex's spellbooks :D 18:48 kek 18:48 go slow 18:48 wha'ts time do? 18:48 stop time? 18:49 nah, time is drain life, except monsters can't resist 18:49 ah I see 18:49 sniper beam? 18:49 long-range beam that damages monsters 18:49 this game is too much chaos for me 18:49 don't remember the range, but it's 30 or so 18:49 too much randomness 18:49 lol 18:49 detect foot still exists right 18:49 Porkman: well there's a reason why only one person ever ascended it 18:49 >_> and it was the dev 18:49 i mean, awesome effort on programming it 18:49 ri-corpse-san: slex doesn't remove stuff, ever 18:49 >_> 18:50 @d?amysbane 18:50 No such monster. 18:50 @d?amy's bane 18:50 No such monster. 18:50 ;-; 18:50 lol. spellbooks of null 18:51 [slex] porkman (Wiz Dop Fem Cha), 69765 points, T:4812, killed by a monster (Radio Katcher), while paralyzed by a monster attack 18:51 Go Team Kop! 18:51 lel 18:51 and man, this whole slew of kops 18:51 don't underestimate hte power of cream pies 18:51 LarienTelrunya: I thought you removed the missingno segfaults at least. 18:51 heh, Elronnd inspired me to do this: if you commit a lot of shoplifting, kops will now actively chase after you for a while 18:51 jonadab: well that's a bugfix 18:52 Technically, a bugfix counts as removing bugs :-)] 18:52 goodnight 18:52 thanks for the... experience :p 18:52 see you, I'll also go to bed now :) 18:52 heh, it was nice watching you! 18:53 -!- Jendic has quit [Quit: *poof*] 18:53 Elronnd: Porkman is out, you have to take over the "someone besides Amy must ascend slex" mission now. 18:53 isn't it past midnight in germany larien :p 18:53 Ready set go. 18:54 00:54, yeah 18:54 I'll try :p but only as doppelgangers or angels 18:54 they're OP enough for my tastes 18:54 "Sleep is for the weak" -- Pitr 18:54 -!- LarienTelrunya has quit [Quit: Amy zaps herself with a wand of "sleep for 12 hours straight"!] 18:55 gnight :p 18:56 YASI: a new NetHack mode where you play as the High Priest of Moloch, and the game sends a never-ending stream of adventurers to try to kill you and take the Amulet; each one is more powerful than the last. 18:56 doens't slex have a rodney mode or smth? 18:57 Well, there's Rodneyan race, but it starts at the top like everybody. Unless lostsoul, of course. 18:57 lostsoul? 18:57 is that a race? 18:57 A mode in slex where you start at Medusa's Island. 18:58 huh 18:59 k then 18:59 [slex] rikersan (Wiz Rod Mal Neu), 11994 points, T:7, killed by a monster (piranha) 18:59 that ended fast 18:59 rodney wizard 19:00 [slex] Tarrant (Nec Bre Mal Law), 3130 points, T:2368, killed by a blast of acid 19:04 [slex] Tarrant (Cha Bre Mal Cha), 0 points, T:366, killed by a monster (sewer rat) 19:07 -!- Porkman has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:07 -!- ri-corpse-san has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:09 YASI: Lord Surtur should wield Fire Brand if it's not already generated, since the mythology has him wielding a flaming sword. 19:12 EPI: between the Vibrating Square level and the Sanctum, there is a ten-level branch consisting of mazes wherein the walkable area is made entirely out of drawbridges. These are all non-teleport, and levelport does not work below the VS level at all. Each of these levels has 20 soldiers and 20 wands of striking. 19:13 jonadab: you're really fixated on EPIs that add a lot of evil maze levels huh 19:14 The whole point of the Evil Patch is to make the game unplayable. 19:17 [slex] Tarrant (Wiz Bre Mal Neu), 1512 points, T:784, killed by a noise trap 19:17 -!- ri-corpse-san has joined #hardfought 19:26 -!- Tarmunora has joined #hardfought 19:27 -!- Tarmunora is now known as Tarmumortem 19:29 -!- Spookunora has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:42 LarienTelrunya │ ri-corpse-san: slex doesn't remove stuff, ever 19:42 this is incorrect 19:43 FIQ: why are you providing nh version and OS version for a feature request 19:43 aosdict: Because if I don't, it will likely get stuck in spam filters 19:43 ais told me so 19:44 63de2ad8791472a4589c1c28fc59cccdc194329d 19:44 This is a slex commit with significant gameplay impact that removes things 20:12 !tell LarienTelrunya Heh, never noticed this before (because when I'm on my main computer, I do Google searches with a bookmark keyword), but if you go to Google and start typing "slashem extended", the first completion it suggests is "slashem extended tileset". 20:12 Will do, jonadab! 20:17 [fh] A hot single Mahou Shoujo (Luxidream) (Wiz Orc Fem Cha) were chosen to steal souls for the glory of Anhur, on T:16656 20:25 !tell LarienTelrunya https://imgur.com/a/HPbNP 20:25 Will do, jonadab! 20:28 jitterbug? 20:28 Fourk-specific monster. 20:28 what does that do anyway? 20:28 It's mainly notable for being faster than the player, very early in the game; it also has a passive displace attack, meaning it switches places with you when you hit it (if it survives). 20:29 It's weak, though. 20:29 Not really dangerouis. 20:29 Appears very early. 20:30 I think foxes may be the only other thing that can show up _that_ early and be faster than the game. 20:30 EPI: each successful hit from a jitterbug increases frame jittering (if playing with a graphical windowport.) 20:30 Err, faster than the player. 20:30 the game should have a variant of grid bugs 20:30 (Assuming human player; some other races are slower than 12.) 20:30 diagonal bugs? 20:30 that are faster 20:30 and hurts more 20:30 bishop bugs! 20:30 but by learning how to do diagonal movement 20:30 you can deal with them easily 20:30 FIQ: Ah, but still constrained to cardinal directions? 20:31 yes 20:31 That's an interesting idea. 20:31 then if players keep dying to them 20:31 you know why ;) 20:31 jonadab: dNetHack has another monster constrained to cardinals actually 20:31 in Gehennom 20:31 "I only use the arrow keys, because I don't have a keypad on this laptop" would be why. 20:32 basically Gehennom's equavilent to grid bugs 20:32 slex has grid xorns, but let's not go there. 20:32 pushovers when you face them 20:32 but carelessness can lead to sadness 20:32 they have a shredding attack 20:32 shreds armro 20:32 *armor 20:33 jonadab: when I first did xhity merge of AD_ELEC 20:33 Ah, Sharing Saturday is up. Cogmind is of course talking all about Steam. 20:33 I forgot to apply the level restriction to item destruction 20:33 Luxidream (IIRC) had a grid bug destroy all of his wands 20:33 Eep. 20:41 added my own commit 20:45 *comment 20:48 !tell K2 fixed major FIQHack bug 20:48 Will do, FIQ! 20:51 hmm. In the quest redesigns I have not considered how wallified plain rock would look in tiles. 20:51 It'd probably look like manmade walls, which is not what I want. 20:56 -!- Jendic has joined #hardfought 21:00 aosdict: Depends on the tileset. 21:00 Some do a better job with this than others. 21:01 Though what you'd _really_ want is multiple possible versions of the tile that get substituted in (apparently at random but deterministically so they don't move around, which would be distracting). 21:18 jonadab: you should make a flying monster with a displacement attack 21:18 and have them like using it over water 21:18 or traps 21:20 18.6k turns in, 18 floors down, and the game finally gives me a floating eye corpse 21:21 heh 21:21 K2: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-20 20:48 EDT: fixed major FIQHack bug 21:24 hi 21:24 Hello bug_sniper, Welcome to #hardfought 21:24 -!- ri-corpse-san has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:25 did someone want me to run my script to get a list of roles? 21:25 Tangles, are you still there? 21:25 and K2, will we hear another "FIQhack updated" today? 21:26 FIQhack updated 21:26 there we are 21:26 I just found a 4x11 barracks 21:26 so I put on a ring of conflict 21:26 and improvised with a bugle 21:27 :) 21:27 this will either be glorious or a disaster 21:27 possibly both 21:27 soon... 21:34 -!- tacco| has quit [] 21:34 FIQ: Also an interesting thought. 21:36 A logical monster with a displacement attack would be a charging bull. 21:36 Actually, a bull should charge, and then you have to pass a Dex save to be displaced by it, or else get gored. 21:38 [fh] A hot single Mahou Shoujo (Luxidream) (Wiz Orc Fem Cha) wished for "uncursed fireproof magic marker", on T:23367 21:38 aosdict: What would be a logical flying, floating, swimming, or amphibious monster to have a displacement attack? 21:39 not sure 21:40 horsefly? 21:40 Why would a horsefly displace you? 21:40 when I'm at the lake and there are horseflies around, they sure displace ME into water :D 21:40 it's a pet 21:40 aosdict: Ah. 21:45 -!- ri-corpse-san has joined #hardfought 21:49 -!- ri-corpse-san has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:53 -!- ais523 has joined #hardfought 21:58 -!- ais523 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:59 -!- ais523 has joined #hardfought 22:18 -!- ri-corpse-san has joined #hardfought 22:20 [nd] Eleven (Wiz Hum Fem Neu), 94 points, T:414, killed by a fox 22:25 -!- ri-corpse-san has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 22:33 uff da why do I catch up on scrollback 22:34 ais523: hi! have you considered making the testbench create temporary saves that is deleted on success, so that there is a save in case it segfaults? 22:34 FIQ: it does, just not in the normal directory 22:34 ais523: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-18 17:36 EDT: "I think maybe it's fiqhack that has it so that if the bow is offhand, you automatically swap it into mainhand? :: IMO there should probably be a confirmation for throwing arrows by hand, though" FIQHack has both. The 2nd only applies to 'f'iring, not 't'hrowing. 22:34 ais523: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-18 20:00 EDT: So regarding brandings and stuff. Would it be a good idea if you could set a high priority in tilesets? Something like (tile match): bgblue+1 basechar. It could be used for cases like fixing the object pile issue I was having with slashem-16 and making stair branding overriding object pile branding 22:34 ais523: Message from jonadab at 2017-10-19 06:44 EDT: Gaelan popped into #nethack4 earlier and requested a password reset. 22:34 ais523: Message from raisse at 2017-10-20 08:56 EDT: can you change the devnull_nethack topic to point to https://www.hardfought.org/devnull/ please? 22:34 currently I've been piping it through gdb to get a chance to see why it segfaults so I can insert a panic/impossible at the location for it to give me a save 22:34 oh? then where? 22:34 I think it's called ./testbench_ and then some random letters 22:35 not 100% sure on that though 22:35 well 22:35 do you mean in the nethack4-testsuite-(stuff) directory? 22:36 FIQ: it's created separately for each run, and deleted if the run concludes successfully 22:36 IIRC 22:36 I'll look at the source to figure it out I suppose 22:37 Tangles: what IRC channel are we using for the tribute tournament gameplay discussion? #devnull_nethack? this channel? #nethack? 22:38 a new channel? 22:38 I can redirect #devnull_nethack if needed 22:38 ais523: how long did you usually run the testbench btw? I ran it for about 300k runs earlier until it found an error 22:38 seems like it has found most stuff it can find 22:39 I haven't run it in a while, used to be "until something goes wrong" though 22:39 it used to find problems much more often back then, but most have been fixed now 22:39 on seed 1, NetHack4 crashes on test 4500ish 22:39 regressions i guess 22:40 IIRC it was an uhitm segfault, I didn't look close 22:40 er 22:40 *uim 22:40 oh right, I'm not sure if I've run the test in the uim era 22:40 it would have been run closer to release 22:40 Heh 22:41 That's kinda why I ended up fixing some minor issues it had with FIQHack (due to new "windowtype" functions) and fired it up recently :P 22:41 because I'm getting to a point where I can do a formal release 22:42 just that currently feels like dubious timing because it's close to devnull 22:42 release on december 1 :-) 22:42 Heh :P 22:42 I did consider it 22:42 or if you're participating in devnull-tribute, on december 8 or so 22:42 so that you don't have to cancel playing to work on release preparation 22:43 Mhm 22:44 really I should try to get aimake to generate Debian packages automatically 22:44 I started work on that but didn't finish it 22:45 btw, msi generation works fine 22:45 the issue jonadab had was unrelated 22:45 it had to do with the *icon*, for some reason 22:45 aimake didn't like rgb-mode PNGs on Windows 22:45 whatever that means, I don't really know how pngs work 22:45 because Debian has two sorts of packages, "Debian native packages" which were written for Debian, and packages which contain glue code written by Debian to link other people's code into their system 22:46 and an aimake-generated package isn't either 22:46 also, hmm, a Windows icon from Vista onwards is literally just a header followed by a bunch of PNG files verbatim 22:46 well jonadab changed the icon PNGs from rgb to indexed 22:46 then aimake worked 22:46 so the problem may be aimake failing to parse the PNG file to be able to write the header? 22:47 Not sure. It worked fine for me on Linux before the png change 22:47 (with aimake too -- I had to use it for tiles since kerio's Makefile never bothered with the SDL stuff) 22:47 what was the error message? 22:52 -!- greqrg_ has joined #hardfought 22:53 -!- greqrg has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:04 -!- Grasshopper has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:07 YASI: wand of teleoperation - allows applying/reading/zapping items in the path of the beam 23:10 Zap it at monsters do drink their potions? Hmm 23:11 in fiqhack, that'd be an EPI 23:11 make monsters zap it at you 23:11 apply your boh and steal all the stuff 23:13 FIQ: oh right, you just reminded me of Ninjask from Pokémon Mystery Dungeon 23:13 it has an attack that uses your items when it hits you 23:13 making it one of the most dangerous monsters in the game 23:13 bug bite! 23:13 (on the basis that it can use up one of your emergency escape items /per hit/, and you could have used one of those to trivialise the encounter) 23:14 yeah 23:14 hmm how did speed boost work in PMD again? does it do multiple attacks per turn, making the entire ordeal even worse? 23:14 speed boosts in PMD are a little complex 23:15 basically the way it works is that you get X moves per turn but attacking ends your turn 23:15 and, to my knowledge, slightly buggy in corner cases 23:15 however, if your speed increases after you've already attacked, you can use the new move that you just got 23:15 because attacking basically just counts as "all your remaining moves" 23:15 from what I've heard, certain setups (mostly involving Time Tripper or speed boostin abilities) can allow you to stunlock things 23:15 but using your current number of remaining moves 23:15 RIght 23:16 Hence triple-agility shenanigans 23:16 this means that if you have an attack that boosts your speed, with side effects 23:16 you can spam it six times in a row 23:16 (Agility being a good example, IIRC it's an area effect speed boost) 23:16 Isn't the speed limit 4? 23:16 Yeah, it is 23:16 Always fun in monster houses 23:16 -!- Jendic has quit [Quit: *poof*] 23:17 I thought it was higher, might depend on the version though 23:17 anyway there are a ton of different ways to stunlock things in PMD 23:17 a good natural example is Bronzor in PMD2:ZIS 23:18 it has both Imprison and Hypnosis, which cause delayed and sleep status respectively 23:18 nice 23:18 you can cast the sleep before the delay wears off and vice versa, meaning that the opponent never gets a turn 23:18 Heh 23:18 (this doesn't work with one of the statuses by themselves because in Pokémon mechanics, you can't inflict a status on someone who already has it) 23:19 Right 23:20 you can do something similar with seeds, although ofc that burns consumables 23:20 Technically moves are consumables :P 23:20 Just... very slow ones 23:20 in PMD everything is a consumable :-) 23:20 in addition to the food clock, there's a PP clock 23:20 That's kind of its thing 23:21 Would be interesting to see a RL in a similar vein that isn't properitiary 23:21 the only attack that doesn't use at least one PP charge (which is indirectly a fraction of a consumable) or a consumable item really sucks 23:21 FIQ: I have plans! 23:21 not much more than plans, though, sadly 23:21 ahh 23:21 but I've been working on the plans themselves on and off for years 23:21 I see 23:23 ais523: I think Lunar Dance might avoid the PP clock if it works similar to how Healing Wish does 23:23 allthough I guess it's possible that it still drains its own PP to prevent this 23:23 does PMD have Sketch? 23:24 my immediate first thought was "there's no way to chain Lunar Dances because there's only one Cresselia" 23:24 PMD most certainly have Sketch 23:24 I mean, what else would Smeargle have? 23:24 that said, if you're going to the extent of setting up a Cresselia + Smeargle combo 23:24 FIQ: did you see what they did to Ditto? :-D 23:24 Yes, PMD1-2 Ditto is basically worthless 23:25 hmm, I wonder if that was an attempt to avoid grinding tricks; a Ditto using main game mechanics would actually be really powerful as you could copy your own party members and then use their attacks for a whole floor spending no PP besides that for Transform itself 23:25 (Not sure how PSMD Ditto works from the player's POV given it is basically a mimic as an enemy form) 23:25 Heh 23:27 Lunar Dance reduces the user's HP to 1, and restores all the HP and PP of team members in the same room as the user. It also removes any status conditions on those Pokémon and breaks any move seals caused by seal traps. 23:27 from bulbapedia 23:27 my only PMD2:ZIS win was heavily based around Bulk Up 23:27 So I guess you could setup an infinite combo :P 23:27 And because Rest can outheal famished, you can grind infinitely 23:27 because it affects your whole time on the floor 23:27 Can't do it in ZIS though because you're alone 23:28 also you can't grind infinitely in PMD, there's a time limit per floor 23:28 (also apparently Cress learns it at 84) 23:28 I run close to it when grinding for Kecleon sometimes (I've never actually recruited a Kecleon, but I've set up reliable recruiting factories; just never hit those 1%, or is it 0.1%, odds) 23:29 I think it's 0.1%, yeah 23:29 *With* all the boosts 23:29 ais523: Doesn't only the earlier dungeons have that limitation? 23:29 I thought they all did, not sure though 23:29 Or is it just that the later ones have such a large clock on those that you usually never see it? 23:30 ZIS level 1 is very easy, you could probably survive it until timeout, the main problem would be food 23:31 only level 1 99-dungeon floor I've beaten is wish cave in PMD1 23:31 pretty sure it's also the easiest 23:32 I've only beaten ZIS once, and I wrote a YAFVP 23:32 farthest I've gotten in ZIS is into the 50s IIRC 23:32 and posted it to rgrm 23:32 m? 23:33 misc 23:33 ah 23:33 got a link? 23:33 for all the roguelikes that don't have their own newsgroup 23:33 mhm 23:33 it was basically a DCSS newsgroup for a while, now it's basically empty 23:33 ahh 23:33 hmm, what was Moria's newsgroup? 23:33 also finding the original link might be hard, I'll just rehost it 23:33 also rgrm? 23:34 FIQ: http://nethack4.org/pastebin/pmd-zis-yafvp.txt 23:34 Mew... because of the TM freedom I guess? 23:35 Grimy Food (besides the obvious use, I used these as a makeshift poison cure on occasion; paralysis, one of the possible results, overrides poison) 23:35 heh, didn't know that 23:35 or just forgot 23:35 TM freedom is the normal reason why people recommend Mew 23:35 however, swimming ability and Synchronize are actually really useful, and the typing is good too 23:36 Are we just a Pokemon channel now? :P 23:36 I could see synchronize being helpful for pesky paralysis 23:36 Tarmumortem: we discuss roguelike design quite a bit 23:37 Pokémon Mystery Dungeon is really unusually designed as roguelikes go, and is something worth learning from, even if you don't want to copy it exactly 23:37 it certainly isn't perfect 23:37 FIQ: right, Synchronize is effectively paralysis immunity 23:37 because everyone being paralysed is equivalent to nobody being paralysed 23:37 1v1, that is 23:37 yeah 23:38 that might make for a fun joke item in NetHack 23:38 Going to be honest, I've only played the mainline games, so I had no idea there even *was* a roguelike Pokemon game 23:38 although it'd be very powerful if comboed with free action 23:39 Tarmumortem: it's kind-of weird; PMD is more a roguelike-inspired game, but it has an actual roguelike in as a bonus level 23:39 that uses the same mechanics but makes modifications to follow roguelike rules, e.g. you start at level 1 with no inventory as a generic member of your species (rather than using your own stats), and no changes made are permanent (each run is independent) 23:39 ais523: metronome in PMD is surprisingly much better than in vanilla games generally 23:40 FIQ: that's because most moves in PMD are useful 23:40 there are a few utter duds like Toxic Spikes 23:40 but many of the moves which are useless in the main series games at least do something in PMD 23:40 that can be useful on occasion 23:40 healing wish would probably be the worst outcome 23:40 since it sets your HP to 1 23:40 in ZIS, yes 23:40 yeah 23:40 it's part of my main team's standard moves in the main game though 23:40 Heh 23:41 you use it to amplify the effects of oran berries (letting you indirectly heal the whole party), and a combination of Bodyguard and Healing Wish lets you set up a reliable Kecleon grinding factory 23:42 (sweeper in front, two tanks with Bodyguard behind, healer with Healing Wish behind that, all in an appropriately shaped dead end) 23:43 hmm, how would NetHack differ from at present if Pw regeneration over time didn't exist, but there were consumables that restored Pw? 23:46 Full casters would feel the pain 23:46 Would encourage wizards to bash things until they get the Eye even more 23:47 ais523: dNetHack has incantifiers 23:47 FIQ: Which have never not been OP 23:47 where pw is basically their hunger 23:47 Tarmumortem: oh they are OP 23:47 Tarmumortem: this might be more friendly to full casters early-game, rather than less 23:47 but that's because Chris gave them a ridiculously large Pw reserve 23:48 in vanilla you get to force bolt maybe twice on the first 3-4 levels 23:48 of 20k-ish 23:50 DIED: dgoddard (Mon-Hum-Mal-Neu), 662 points, killed by an orc zombie on hardfought 23:50 in practice, in PMD it's very hard to run out of PP unless you're wasteful of it