00:18 <Tarmunora> aosdict: You can already go down with > though, can't you?
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05:32 <Beholder> [nd] elagabalus (Pri Hum Fem Neu), 1855 points, T:2421, killed by a dwarf
06:00 <Beholder> [nd] elagabalus (Pri Hum Fem Neu), 1185 points, T:972, killed by a dwarf lord
06:03 <Beholder> [nd] elagabalus (Pri Hum Fem Neu), 24 points, T:173, killed by a goblin
06:29 <FIQ> jonadab: it's random
06:29 <FIQ> all of dnh's 1-level branches are
06:29 <FIQ> sunless sea, lost tomb, moloch's temple
06:29 <FIQ> in order from easiest to hardest
06:29 <FIQ> they can all appear on dlvl5
06:30 <FIQ> I learned what moloch's temple was the hard way in one game where it did
06:30 <FIQ> well, perhaps not 5, but very early
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06:32 <FIQ> jonadab: hm, if I move vlad to gnomish mines as I want to
06:32 <FIQ> I'll probably place a sleeping red dragon close to the tower entrance (inside the tower)
06:32 <FIQ> as a warning "you might want to reconsider" if people go there early
06:34 <FIQ> -red
06:34 <FIQ> +green
07:06 <FIQ> monster damage from item destruction is blatantly asymmetric with players
07:06 <FIQ> they're damaged far less
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07:34 <Beholder> [nd] elagabalus (Pri Hum Fem Neu), 736 points, T:1676, killed by a gecko, while frozen by a monster's gaze
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07:52 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Gno Fem Neu) entered the Planes, on T:41877
07:52 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Gno Fem Neu) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:41877
07:52 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Gno Fem Neu) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:41880
08:13 <FIQ> !tell K2 pushed FIQHack updates: item destruction was reduced
08:13 <Beholder> Will do, FIQ!
08:14 <LarienTelrunya> FIQ: thumbs up for that change :)
08:24 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Gno Fem Neu) genocided class ;, on T:42027
08:28 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Gno Fem Neu) killed Pestilence, on T:42113
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08:36 <Beholder> [nd] elagabalus (Pri Hum Fem Neu), 1596 points, T:2868, killed by a jackal
08:38 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Gno Fem Neu) killed Pestilence, on T:42144
08:39 <raisse> argh I'm sitting on the roof terrace now because it's splendid weather but the network is so slow here
08:39 <raisse> that may kill me
08:40 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Gno Fem Neu) killed Famine, on T:42159
08:42 <raisse> argh, shall I escape in celestial disgrace or finish the grand tour with extra chance of astral splat?
08:42 <raisse> or wish for a HoOA (which somehow feels more like cheating than celestial disgrace does)
08:44 <Beholder> [nd] dgoddard (Mon Hum Mal Neu) changed form for the first time, becoming a golden naga hatchling, on T:6018
08:45 <Beholder> [nd] dgoddard (Mon Hum Mal Neu) chose a runed dagger to be named "Sting", on T:6148
08:45 <aosdict> Tarmunora: oh, so it is. Never mind then.
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08:53 <Beholder> [nd] dgoddard (Mon Hum Mal Neu) acquired the luckstone from Mines' End, on T:7148
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08:55 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Gno Fem Neu) killed Pestilence, on T:42212
08:55 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Gno Fem Neu) killed Death, on T:42227
08:57 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Gno Fem Neu), 2413944 points, T:42254, ascended
https://www.hardfought.org/userdata/R/Raisse/nhdev/dumplog/1507671664.nhdev.txt
08:58 <raisse> !rng pri tou arc
08:58 <Beholder> raisse: pri
08:58 <raisse> beholder?
08:59 <raisse> lol, Rodney on #nethack says the same thing
08:59 <raisse> priest it is
08:59 <raisse> !align
08:59 <raisse> hm
08:59 <raisse> !rng  lawful neutral
08:59 <Beholder> raisse: neutral
09:01 <Tangles> Ooh congrats raisse!!
09:02 <aosdict> congrats!
09:02 <aosdict> I don't think I've ever ascended a gno wiz yet, I think.
09:03 <raisse> thanks Tangles!
09:03 <raisse> I've ascended more gnomish wizards than any other combo (most on nao)
09:04 <FIQ> not neutral I see
09:04 <FIQ> er
09:04 <FIQ> chaotic
09:05 <aosdict> who's the guy that really, really likes gno wiz?
09:05 <aosdict> Wooble?
09:05 <FIQ> idk who you're talking about
09:05 <FIQ> but 50%+ of my games are gno wiz
09:06 <FIQ> my 2nd favorite combo is gnomish healer
09:06 <raisse> [15:06] <Rodney> raisse: race,count(*): 1) Gno,17;  2) Orc,7;  3) Elf,3
09:06 <raisse> those three elf wizards were all for junethack
09:07 <raisse> to get the elf out of the way
09:07 <FIQ> Heh
09:07 <raisse> only 7 orc wizards (and one on hardfought)
09:08 <FIQ> Rodney │ FIQ: race,count(*): 1) Gno,114;  2) Hum,32;  3) Elf,21
09:08 <Tangles> hmm... I have exactly one gnomish wizard.
09:08 <FIQ> for wizards
09:08 <FIQ> overall on NAO, I have this: Rodney │ FIQ: race,count(*): 1) Gno,254;  2) Hum,118;  3) Elf,22;  4) Dwa,6
09:08 <raisse> no orcses?
09:08 <raisse> and only 6 dwarves!
09:09 <FIQ> there's https://scoreboard.xd.cm/players/F/FIQ.all.html
09:09 <FIQ> for my overall stats
09:09 <aosdict> I have no gno or orc wiz at all, actually.
09:09 <FIQ> not sure what's up with my Tou numbers
09:09 <FIQ> I play much more wiz than to
09:09 <FIQ> u
09:10 <FIQ> aosdict: heathen :P
09:10 <FIQ> raisse: but yeah, I have 4 orcs *overall*
09:10 <raisse> 7 dwarf valks on the valk account, and 12 more dwarves on nao (arc, cav and junethack valk)
09:10 <FIQ> I... don't play a lot of orcs
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09:10 <FIQ> Oh, the tou thing is probably 4k scurriers
09:11 <raisse> I have more orc wizards than barbarians (which doesn't surprise me as I like wiz better than bar)
09:11 <aosdict> FIQ: you have exactly 400 wins?
09:11 <FIQ> No... what makes you think that?
09:11 <FIQ> I have 26 wins
09:11 <aosdict> 254 + 118 + 22 + 6
09:11 <FIQ> I'm not sure what you get those numbers from
09:12 <raisse> that's *all*, not only ascensions
09:12 <aosdict> oh, that makes more sense
09:12 <FIQ> ah lol
09:12 <aosdict> Huh. I have actually never ascended an orcish character, ever.
09:12 <FIQ> neither have I
09:13 <FIQ> apparently I have 1 orc on NetHack vanilla
09:13 <FIQ> and 3 orcs on dNetHack
09:13 <raisse> orc wiz is fun!
09:13 <FIQ> not sure what kind of orc I played on NetHack
09:13 <FIQ> the dNetHack ones were probably barbarians
09:13 <FIQ> orc-bar is dnethack's dwa-val
09:14 <aosdict> too bad Beholder doesn't have an !lg command for easy querying
09:15 <Tangles> Yes! orc wiz is fun. As is orc barb, and orc rogue...
09:15 <FIQ> hahaha I just noticed
09:15 <FIQ> games wins wins % scum z-score first game last game realtime
09:15 <FIQ> 2769 26 0.5% 2903 20.4167 2014-10-13 15:42 2017-10-13 18:21 1 months, 27 days, 15:33:10
09:15 <FIQ> notice first/last game
09:16 <aosdict> orc barb makes the most flavor sense. Orc rogue somewhat less so. Orc wiz seems like a game of "So You Want To Be An Orc Shaman".
09:16 <FIQ> !tell Tangles you know what would be cool? !lg
09:16 <Beholder> Will do, FIQ!
09:16 <raisse> can elves be rogues?
09:16 <raisse> (that makes sense to me, somehow)
09:17 <Tangles> !source
09:17 <Beholder> Tangles: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-14 09:16 EDT: you know what would be cool? !lg
09:17 <Beholder> Tangles: https://github.com/NHTangles/beholder
09:17 <FIQ> about as much sense as orc wizards
09:17 <Tangles> help yourself
09:17 <FIQ> pffffff
09:17 <Beholder> [nd] elagabalus (Pri Hum Fem Neu), 1567 points, T:1664, killed by a hill orc
09:17 * FIQ zaps Tangles with a wand of polymorph
09:19 <Beholder> [dnh] Thrak (Bar Hlf Mal Cha) killed Medusa, on T:29259
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09:21 * Tangles turns into a mind flayer and eats some brains (but sadly is still not smart enough to implement !lg)
09:22 <FIQ> :(
09:23 <FIQ> but isn't Beholder based off Rodney?
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09:26 <Tangles> FIQ: The concept is loosely based off Rodney.
09:26 <Tangles> The code is not even the same language.
09:27 <raisse> what language? hallucinogen-distorted Python^W^WPerl?
09:28 <Tangles> Beholder is python. Rodney is perl.
09:28 <Tangles> Beholder was based of Kerio's bot, because the original requirement was to report deaths from multiple variants.
09:29 <Tangles> then people started typing !pom and stuff in this channel and expecting a resopnse, so some Rodney-like commands got implemented over time.
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09:32 <Tangles> There is no back-end database though.  Things like !streak and !asc are implemented by in-memory structures that get populated by reading the xlogfiles every time the bot starts.  This may not be the most scalable solution.
09:33 <raisse> please tell me if my connect problems are too annoying, I can go and use the evil-twin account if necessary
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09:39 <aosdict> irina|log: hey, raisse is calling you names
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09:53 <Beholder> [dnh] rikersan (Mon Hlf Mal Neu) wished for "blessed fixed +3 greased premium heart", on T:1871
09:54 <FIQ> Tangles: Ah
09:56 <aosdict> Tangles: so if I have a streak of 2 games and then win a 3rd, Beholder will still only report 2 until it goes down and back up again
09:56 <aosdict> ?
09:56 <Tangles> aosdict: No, it also reads the xlogfiles as they are generated (which is how it reports deaths)
09:57 <Tangles> It's just that for things like !streak, it *also* has to read the history on startup.
09:58 <Tangles> !streak raisse nhdev
09:58 <Beholder> Tangles: raisse[nd] Max: 1 (2017-03-20 - 2017-03-22). Current: 1 (since 2017-10-10).
09:58 <raisse> try someone who has actually done some streaks?
09:58 <Tangles> Well I wanted to show that it updates with current data.
09:58 <Tangles> 1 is a streak :)
09:59 <raisse> oh, I'm now on a potential streak because theoreticallly I can ascend this game and the next
09:59 <raisse> (in practice that never happens, I think I've got ONE 2-streak on nao)
09:59 <aosdict> oh hey, I'm currently on a 3-streak from junethack on nao.
09:59 <Tangles> It could happen ;)
10:01 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Pri Hum Fem Neu) became literate by reading a book, on T:4516
10:05 <Tangles> so it looks like I am also on a streak on NAO
10:05 <aosdict> maybe for my next nao game I'll play a nice gno wiz or orc wiz :)
10:06 <FIQ> !streak
10:06 <Beholder> FIQ: FIQ Max[gh]: 1 (2017-03-27 - 2017-04-07).
10:07 <FIQ> !streak K2
10:07 <Beholder> FIQ: K2 Max[nh]: 1 (2017-06-02 - 2017-06-03). Current[un]: 1 (since 2017-06-11).
10:07 <FIQ> Doesn't K2 have a GruntHack streak?
10:07 <Tangles> oh that's not right.
10:07 <Tangles> no... Grasshopper does.
10:07 <Tangles> There have only ever been two grunthack streaks.
10:07 <FIQ> ah
10:07 <FIQ> !streak Grassy 
10:07 <Beholder> FIQ: No streaks for Grassy.
10:07 <FIQ> !streak Grasshopper
10:07 <Beholder> FIQ: Grasshopper Max[nd]: 6 (2017-03-17 - 2017-05-14). Current[nd]: 2 (since 2017-08-20).
10:08 <Tangles> !streak grasshopper gh
10:08 <Beholder> Tangles: grasshopper[gh] Max: 2 (2017-06-27 - 2017-07-23)(current).
10:08 <Tangles> !streak k2 gh
10:08 <Beholder> Tangles: k2[gh] Max: 1 (2017-05-09 - 2017-05-11).
10:08 <Tangles> maybe k2 streaked on grunthack.org
10:08 <Tangles> !streak gh
10:08 <Beholder> Tangles: Tangles[gh] Max: 1 (2017-09-04 - 2017-09-11)(current).
10:08 <Tangles> oh right.
10:09 <Beholder> [nh4] FIQ (Tou Hum Mal Neu), 6991 points, T:304, quit
10:09 <Beholder> [dnh] Thrak (Bar Hlf Mal Cha) killed Cerberus, on T:31264
10:09 <Tangles> there's no way to get streaks for everyone, I think.
10:09 <Beholder> [nh4] FIQ (Hea Gno Mal Neu), 6395 points, T:81, quit
10:10 <FIQ> !streak * gh
10:10 <Beholder> FIQ: *[gh]: No streaks.
10:10 <FIQ> !streak k2:a gh
10:10 <Beholder> FIQ: k2:a[gh]: No streaks.
10:10 <Grassy> yes I think that K2's GH streak was on grunthack.org
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10:13 <Beholder> [dnh] Thrak (Bar Hlf Mal Cha) destroyed Vlad the Impaler, on T:31561
10:14 <Beholder> [dnh] Thrak (Bar Hlf Mal Cha) wished for "uncursed magic marker", on T:31574
10:18 <Beholder> [nh4] FIQ (Val Dwa Fem Law), 32901 points, T:3154, killed by an Uruk-hai, while fainted from lack of food
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11:01 <Beholder> [nh4] FIQ (Val Dwa Fem Law), 65920 points, T:7546, killed by an ogre king, while sleeping
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11:37 <jonadab> aosdict: You can just use > to go down into a hole or trapdoor (unless you have uncontrolled levitation).
11:37 <Beholder> [dnh] Thrak (Bar Hlf Mal Cha) killed Axus, on T:33262
11:48 <Beholder> [dnh] Thrak (Bar Hlf Mal Cha) destroyed the Arsenal, on T:33765
11:52 <Beholder> [dnh] Thrak (Bar Hlf Mal Cha) killed Oona, on T:33932
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12:09 <aosdict> jonadab: that's why I said never mind. (although it still would make sense as a redundant command.)
12:11 <Tarmunora> I know that sitting works if you escape the trap, and I think it does when flying as well
12:11 <Tarmunora> *Not when flying/levitating
12:12 <aosdict> > works if you escape the trap.
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12:38 <raisse> What do you want to drink? [dry or ?*] g
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14:12 <Beholder> [nd] munterplant (Val Hum Fem Law) acquired the luckstone from Mines' End, on T:4938
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16:04 <FIQ> !tell K2 pushed some tweaks
16:04 <Beholder> Will do, FIQ!
16:14 <FIQ> !tell LarienTelrunya if you want to crash safely, just use raise(SIGSEGV)
16:14 <Beholder> Will do, FIQ!
16:14 <LarienTelrunya> oh, that works?
16:14 <Beholder> LarienTelrunya: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-14 16:14 EDT: if you want to crash safely, just use raise(SIGSEGV)
16:14 <FIQ> should work yes
16:15 <K2> .
16:15 <Beholder> K2: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-14 08:13 EDT: pushed FIQHack updates: item destruction was reduced
16:15 <Beholder> K2: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-14 16:04 EDT: pushed some tweaks
16:15 <K2> my gh streak was on grunthack.org server
16:19 <FIQ> ah
16:23 <K2> FIQhack updated
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17:20 <NeroOneTrueKing> Any messages for me, beholder?
17:22 <FIQ> !tell K2 Fixed bugs: autodig > and the new <> invokes travel feature, not handling multiturn correctly
17:22 <Beholder> Will do, FIQ!
17:28 <K2> FIQhack updated
17:28 <Beholder> K2: Message from FIQ at 2017-10-14 17:22 EDT: Fixed bugs: autodig > and the new <> invokes travel feature, not handling multiturn correctly
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17:49 <Beholder> [dnh] NeroOneTrueKing (Ana Dwa Fem Cha) was given their Quest, on T:26209
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18:16 <Beholder> [sp] k2 (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 6250 points, T:3872, killed by a winter wolf cub
18:20 <Beholder> [dnh] Thrak (Bar Hlf Mal Cha) was given the Golden Sword of Y'ha-Talla, on T:39695
18:21 <Beholder> [sp] k2 (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 310 points, T:324, killed by a brown mold
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19:42 <jonadab> K2: OBTW, I pushed FIQ's monster lookup stuff to Fourk earlier.
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19:54 <K2> ok cool
19:58 <K2> NetHack Fourk updated
20:00 <jonadab> The object memory stuff, unfortunately, is going to have to wait at least until .5, if not until rebase.
20:00 <jonadab> That's way too fiddly for this late in my dev cycle.
20:01 <FIQ> jonadab: Yes, there is no way 4k is going to have that in .4 with how you approach things
20:01 <jonadab> I'm gunning for a 4.3.0.4 release in hopefully the next few weeks.
20:01 <FIQ> Because it needs new save logic
20:01 <jonadab> Yeah.
20:01 <FIQ> And you despise save shims
20:01 <FIQ> s/shims/versioning/
20:02 <jonadab> Even if not for that, it's not something I'd merge this late in the dev cycle from a stability standpoint.
20:02 <jonadab> It's a nice feature, that I've wanted for a while.
20:02 <jonadab> But the timing is wrong for .4
20:02 <FIQ> Stability? What is that?
20:02 <FIQ> :p
20:03 <jonadab> It took you numerous commits to get to the point where it doesn't crash all the time.
20:03 <jonadab> It's a disruptive change, clearly.
20:03 <FIQ> Yeah
20:03 <FIQ> Allthough it does seem to work now
20:03 <FIQ> So there is that
20:03 <jonadab> Yeah, but understand, once I release .4, it will not receive further updates.
20:03 <FIQ> Possibly missing corner cases though
20:03 <FIQ> but I don't think there will be more *crashes* from it, at least
20:03 <jonadab> So when I'm close to that point, disruptive stuff _does not go in_.
20:04 <FIQ> jonadab: Oh I know
20:04 <FIQ> I'm not trying to get you to change your development strategy :P
20:04 <FIQ> I mean, I do think you have a bit of too much distaste for save versioning, even for trivial things
20:04 <jonadab> It's a shame the object memory stuff missed the cutoff for .4, but it did.
20:04 <FIQ> But other than that, eh, up to you really
20:05 <jonadab> That's a difference in goals, between Fourk and FIQHack.
20:05 <jonadab> Fourk is intended to try out ideas, and see if they make sense.
20:05 <FIQ> (I am talking about the vault thing in overview, which is a trivial change save-wise)
20:05 <FIQ> Right
20:05 <jonadab> So fundamentally, Fourk doesn't mind breaking saves from version to version.
20:05 <FIQ> Mhm
20:06 <jonadab> I'm not trying to be vanilla.
20:06 <FIQ> FIQHack is... pretty much the opposite
20:06 <jonadab> Right, FIQHack is much closer to NH4, in terms of goals.
20:06 <FIQ> I do like being able to fully and successfully load ancient FIQHack saves in the newest versions
20:07 <FIQ> despite how much changed
20:07 <jonadab> Oh, I admire that about FIQHack.
20:07 <jonadab> But for Fourk, I don't wish to devote the effort to that; it's not important for Fourk's goals, IMO.
20:07 <FIQ> I find it too bad that I didn't implement versioning from the getgo
20:07 <FIQ> That would've allowed FIQHack to trivially recognize NetHack4 saves
20:07 <jonadab> Yeah, something like that, the earlier you do it, the better.
20:08 <jonadab> If you're going to do it, that is.
20:08 <FIQ> Which would be cool
20:08 <FIQ> *would've been
20:08 <jonadab> I'm kind of surprised NH4 doesn't do that, actually.
20:09 <FIQ> I am not a fan of how NetHack4 does save compat stuff
20:09 <jonadab> At the very least, being able to say, "This save is from version 4.2, you need version 4.2 to load it", would be better than NOT being able to say that.
20:09 <FIQ> It essentially implements it as shims, relying on things having certain values
20:09 <FIQ> (and not a dedicated version flag for it, that is)
20:09 <jonadab> Actually, I should do that for Fourk in .5
20:10 <jonadab> "This save is from 4.3.0.4 or earlier."
20:10 <FIQ> jonadab: Not only that
20:10 <FIQ> If you try to load an old save, version-wise
20:10 <FIQ> in NetHack4 or Fourk
20:10 <FIQ> the game will *crash*
20:10 <jonadab> IME, it just says it can't load it, doesn't explain why.
20:11 <FIQ> This game needs manual recovery? That's the general error condition if it runs into fatal issues loading saves
20:11 <FIQ> However, should there be a mismatch in the version field
20:11 <FIQ> the game will crash before it reaches this point
20:12 <FIQ> Also that's actually a NitroHack save error, only that the prompt for removing the save was removed
21:10 <Beholder> [sp] k2 (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 1167 points, T:1479, killed by a rabid rat
21:14 <Beholder> [sp] k2 (Pri Hum Mal Neu), 48 points, T:1534, killed by a newt
21:55 <NeroOneTrueKing> So dnethack has a couple of passive monster attacks that kill the defending monster (ie foo hits bar, bar's passive kills bar)
21:56 -!- Grassy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
21:57 <NeroOneTrueKing> But the attackchain logic doesn't have any checks after bar's passive to see if bar is dead or alive, so if there is a new attack, we get a dmonsfree error
22:04 <aosdict> why would a monster have a passive attack to kill itself?
22:04 <aosdict> some sort of y or e?
22:04 <Tarmunora__> Certain nymphs
22:04 <NeroOneTrueKing> naiads and swamp nymphs
22:05 <NeroOneTrueKing> they collapse into puddles when hit and they go under 50% health, 2/3rds of the time
22:05 <aosdict> is this some sort of defensive maneuver? like they can later regenerate from the puddle?
22:06 <NeroOneTrueKing> nope
22:06 <NeroOneTrueKing> it's for flavour
22:06 <NeroOneTrueKing> and so that their passive rusting / deathly sickness, respectively, isn't too dangerous for the player
22:08 <NeroOneTrueKing> ie) smacking a naiad to death with a long sword will only rust it once.
22:12 -!- tacco| has quit []
22:37 <jonadab> I'd like to see the amount of rustiness of an iron object have more than four states.
22:38 <jonadab> I mean, I don't mind that it's only displayed in vague terms (rusty, very rusty, thoroughly rust).
22:38 <jonadab> But it should take more than one rusting event to get it from rusty to very rusty, for example.
22:38 <jonadab> Or, rather, more than two to get it from not rusty to very rusty.
22:39 <NeroOneTrueKing> ooh, I see a further implication in that then an item can "rust away completely" and not have the mechanic be evil
22:39 <aosdict> If rust only minimally increments, do you think stuff like "Your foo rusts further!" should still be displayed if the state isn't changing?
22:39 <aosdict> s/state/display
22:40 <aosdict> NeroOneTrueKing: yes, grunthack is only evil with this because erodeables only have four "lives".
22:48 <Beholder> [dnh] NeroOneTrueKing (Ana Dwa Fem Cha) killed the invisible Malcanthet, on T:27971
22:50 <aosdict> I'd also kind of like to see different severities of illness, instead of "guaranteed to kill you eventually".
22:50 <aosdict> NeroOneTrueKing: this is actually another instadeath we didn't address
22:51 <NeroOneTrueKing> Yes. The status-effect instadeaths are mostly fine
22:51 <NeroOneTrueKing> but sickness can have its duration reduced
22:51 <NeroOneTrueKing> and unlike stoning and sliming isn't very verbose for how long you have left to live
22:51 <aosdict> perhaps instead of a death timer, it could apply a penalty to your HP regen rate
22:52 <aosdict> and with a large enough penalty, regen becomes negative
22:52 <aosdict> this is pretty flexible since it allows for minor disease attacks in the early game
22:53 <NeroOneTrueKing> Permanent effect until cured? Incremental curing?
22:53 <aosdict> I was thinking more of a gradual return to normal, yes.
22:53 <aosdict> But of course, hanging around the source of the sickness is likely to make you worse instead.
22:55 <NeroOneTrueKing> I could see it requiring potions of healing, spell cure sickness, or #chatting with a priest or #prayer to remove completely, and only partially timing out
22:56 <NeroOneTrueKing> So the negative regen times out, but health recovery is stunted.
22:59 <aosdict> If you get only incidental sickness, though, like from a passing rabid rat encounter, I feel like you should return fully to health eventually.
22:59 <NeroOneTrueKing> Sure!
23:01 <aosdict> With a sufficiently long timeout, you wouldn't need to cap the amount of recovery, I think. Because it'll take too long to recover otherwise.
23:02 <NeroOneTrueKing> So long as the methods of recovering are accessible and obvious, unlike current hallucination
23:03 <aosdict> I mean, if you *want* to sit in a closet for 10000 turns after an encounter with Scorpius or Demogorgon, great, but if you can get back to normal instantly by quaffing healing, what's the point?
23:03 <NeroOneTrueKing> and the go-to strategy is not "n400."
23:04 <aosdict> Unicorn horns would naturally cure this, but that makes them seem too powerful. (They are, in fact, too powerful anyway.)
23:04 <NeroOneTrueKing> Change: Unicorn horns don't cure, they reduce the count remaining
23:05 <aosdict> then you can re-apply until cured? Doesn't seem much different
23:05 <NeroOneTrueKing> re-applying in the middle of combat won't help
23:09 <NeroOneTrueKing> furthermore, you'd notice between intensities of blinding/stunning/confusion/etc since some would take more turns than others to get rid of
23:09 <NeroOneTrueKing> does this solve unicorn horns? No. Is it better? Yes
23:10 <aosdict> Oh, you meant for this to apply for *all* timed effects.
23:11 <NeroOneTrueKing> I thought about suggesting that earlier, but then I thought of how sickness timing out is a bad thing for the player, so I kindof forgot about it
23:17 <Tarmunora__> [21:51:53] <aosdict> perhaps instead of a death timer, it could apply a penalty to your HP regen rate. This seems like it would make sickness something the player can simply ignore until the end of an encounter, especially since a common theme is 'nerf natural regen' anyways
23:18 <Tarmunora__> Perhaps make sickness attacks deal bonus damage based on your sickness 'stacks', to keep some of the in-combat deadliness\
23:19 <NeroOneTrueKing> Good idea there
23:19 <aosdict> It works gameplay-wise, but not flavor-wise, I think.
23:20 <aosdict> No particular reason a goblin hitting you with a dagger will hit any harder because you have the flu.
23:20 <NeroOneTrueKing> sickness attacks, he said
23:20 <aosdict> oh
23:20 <NeroOneTrueKing> So demogorgon's claws will hurt extra, but not the goblin's dagger
23:20 <Tarmunora__> Unless the goblin sneezed on the dagger
23:21 <aosdict> goblins are a notoriously unhygienic bunch
23:29 <NeroOneTrueKing> So:
23:29 <NeroOneTrueKing> 1) Sickness attacks cause an "Illness" status effect
23:29 <NeroOneTrueKing> 2) Being hit by a sickness attack while Ill extends the Illness effect by some amount [dependent on the attack(er)?]
23:29 <NeroOneTrueKing> 3) Being hit by a sickness attack while Ill deals bonus damage proportional to your Illness's remaining duration
23:29 <NeroOneTrueKing> 4) Unicorn horns partially reduce the Illness duration, not instantly cure.
23:33 <aosdict> Still think HP regen penalties should be applied, maybe just on top of all this.
23:34 <NeroOneTrueKing> Natural health regeneration is fully negated while you are Ill. Short(ish) timeout, so this will be an in-combat effect.
23:37 <Beholder> [dnh] NeroOneTrueKing (Ana Dwa Fem Cha) killed Bael, on T:28161
23:42 <Beholder> [dnh] NeroOneTrueKing (Ana Dwa Fem Cha) killed the invisible Baphomet, on T:28336
23:51 <Beholder> [dnh] NeroOneTrueKing (Ana Dwa Fem Cha) killed Baalzebub, on T:28605
23:55 <Beholder> [dnh] NeroOneTrueKing (Ana Dwa Fem Cha) killed Dagon, on T:28765
23:59 <Beholder> [dnh] Tarmunora (Ana Dro Fem Cha) completed Sokoban, on T:44910