00:18 -!- remirol has joined #hardfought 00:19 -!- elenmirie_ has joined #hardfought 00:20 -!- lorimer has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:21 -!- elenmirie has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:21 -!- elenmirie_ is now known as elenmirie 00:27 -!- Tangles has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:29 -!- Tangles has joined #hardfought 00:29 -!- mode/#hardfought [+o Tangles] by ChanServ 00:37 bhaak: can un be considered actively maintained? 00:38 I guess last update was just a few months ago 00:38 so yes 00:38 ais523: I actually reported an issue with the stacking of the vomiting timer to DT a while backl 00:38 *back 00:39 alongside other issues where timers was overwritten or stacked incorrectly 00:39 IIRC it was considered not a bug 00:39 let me see if I can find the reply 00:42 holy crap I accidentally bought a pair of gauntlets of power 00:44 [gh] k2 (Mon Elf Mal Neu), 12540 points, T:6644, frozen by a blue jelly 00:44 that was dumb 00:45 At least you didn't do that on turn 52 during the Junethack tournament 00:47 that would have been preferrable 00:47 i thought i had a charge in my wand of striking 00:47 didnt, went that direction anyways 00:47 hit cold dead 01:02 use msgtype 01:02 for cases like that 01:02 need to 01:02 its really rare though 01:02 !lastgame 01:02 K2: https://www.hardfought.org/userdata/k/k2/gh/dumplog/1504755664.gh.txt 01:03 need a stop event for 'nothing happens' 01:03 use my config :P 01:05 new hurricane apparently 01:05 2 01:06 jose and katia 01:06 and irma (cat5) is wiping the caribbean off the map just about 01:06 wow another one? 01:06 yeah 01:06 didn't know about katia lol 01:07 fairly new development 01:07 My landlady assures me that it's a manmade storm part of the government's plan to kill everyone. 01:07 rush limbaugh said the other day he believes irma is a hoax/fake news story created by liberals to control people 01:08 he needs to stop forgetting to take his meds 01:09 or stop self-medicating, maybe 01:10 heh 01:10 i wonder if/when he'll recant 01:13 That's interesting, this stone golem turned into a statue instead of a pile of rocks 01:14 eh, if you admit you're wrong your pundit license gets revoked 01:14 don't they usually turn into statues? clay golems turn into rock piles 01:15 at crap Katia formed in the gulf of mexico 01:15 I could have sworn stone golems were piles of rocks 01:15 yikes category 5 01:15 watch it head north... geez 01:15 no katia is just cat1 at the moment 01:15 irma is cat5 01:16 but even a tropical storm would be *bad* for the texas coast right now 01:17 ugh 01:17 Barbuda reports nearly 100% of all homes there destroyed by irma 01:18 [nh4] Philip (Crawldragon) (Arc Hum Fem Law), 41428 points, T:3969, killed by a flesh golem 01:18 a cat5 hurricane is like having a tornado come and just sit in the same spot for hours. but miles and miles wide 01:23 zapping a stone golem with striking or force bolt should instakill it 01:25 -!- raisse has joined #hardfought 01:25 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v raisse] by ChanServ 01:28 K2, but with a storm surge and a lot of rain 01:36 -!- LarienTelrunya has joined #hardfought 01:52 [slex] Yuring (Pok Dro Fem Neu), 310 points, T:799, killed by a shotgun shell 01:52 [dnh] Danthrax (Pri Elf Mal Cha), 1426 points, T:1800, killed by a dwarf 01:54 * bug_sniper shoots a dwarf at K2 01:55 hm 01:55 I can't find the reply to that mail D: 01:58 01:03 need a stop event for 'nothing happens' <------ that :P it's one of the first things slex did, add a --More-- prompt to that message, and same for "You fail to cast the spell correctly." How many times did I move because muscle memory made me hit a direction after using z or Z? TOO MANY TIMES!!! 02:01 git gud skrub 02:10 ais523: do you know what this issue is about? https://github.com/FredrIQ/fiqhack/issues/20 02:10 it concerns the save system 02:19 [dyn] Philip (Crawldragon) (Arc Hum Mal Law), 951 points, T:1885, killed by a homunculus, while sleeping 02:19 FIQ: that could very well be the bug I fixed in NH4 recently with integer overflow 02:20 I'd recommend confirming it's not that (e.g. via rewinding and continuing the save on a version with that patch pulled) before continuing 02:20 note that the fix won't make it possible to load broken save files (unless you rewind them to before the issue), it'll just avoid producing them 02:22 ais523: considering there is not enough info to reproduce it properly in the issue, I think I'll close it for now 02:23 unless LarienTelrunya can provide more info on exactly when it happened 02:24 It happened once on the samurai quest while I was fiddling with my bag of holding, and then again much later also while fiddling with my bag of holding. 02:24 hm 02:24 I must have fumbled some key, don't know which one, and that made the error message show up. 02:24 yeah that isn't enough info 02:24 going to close the issue then 02:24 f 02:24 eel free to reopen it if it happens again 02:25 On the first time it happened, I couldn't even react quickly enough because I didn't expect it, so whatever key I then hit must have caused it to go into "you have to bug kerio to recover it and he'll take his sweet time instead of doing it immediately" mode. :/ 02:25 LarienTelrunya: the old bug in question could be triggered by almost anything, although mostly ineffective actions (i.e. ones making small gamestate changes only) are the most likely to cause it 02:25 ais523: so you've seen that error message too?# 02:25 whoops 02:26 it was a fatfingered key like this one (probably it wasn't the # key though) that triggered it :P 02:26 LarienTelrunya: not that /precise/ error message but it looks a lot like random save corruption, which was the actual symptom 02:26 of the bug in question 02:26 FIQ: ok, though it'll be about 9 months until I play it again 02:26 (I should say, random diff corruption, the rest of the save wasn't hurt) 02:26 ok 02:27 LarienTelrunya: see this is why I encourage you to play here :P 02:27 more realible server admins 02:27 ais523: ah, I see; IIRC I had a similar error in nh4 as well, when I tried to pick a lit magic lamp I got from a bones file, but then loading and doing random other actions for a few turns allowed me to circumvent it 02:28 ais523: I tried the divide by 10 thing as I asked you about earlier 02:28 It... well 02:28 Didn't really work out as intended 02:28 FIQ: would really be the better idea if my hdf ping from Germany wasn't so much worse than my esm/ascrun ping ;) 02:28 [ ] 02:28 1504013235_hothraxxa.nhgame 02:28 2017-09-06 15:31 378M 02:28 this is what happened 02:29 it would create a binary checkpoint for every single turn for a while 02:29 here in my office, I have a ping of 7 ms to esm and 139 ms to hdf 02:29 and in the end it was still doing it every 40 turns-ish 02:29 FIQ: right, that doesn't seem ideal 02:29 I think you probably tweaked the numbers too high :-) 02:29 ais523: well at least it fixed the performance issues :D 02:29 at home I have about 70 ms to esm and 300 ms (with spikes of 700 ms and more) to hdf :( 02:29 hothraxxa mentioned that loading fiqhack saves after that change was blazing fast 02:29 which isn't that surprising :P 02:30 that's not surprising at all, given the context 02:30 idea: closing the game with the S command writes a save backup if there hasn't been one recently 02:30 this is what I changed 02:30 if ((program_state.binary_save.pos / 2) < 02:30 (program_state.gamestate_location - program_state.save_backup_location) 02:30 || !program_state.ok_to_diff) 02:30 the / 2 there was a / 10 02:30 (previously there was no divison at all) 02:30 ais523: oh, there's also something I wanted to ask... why does nh4 make it so that impossible() crashes the game? Is there a reason for that? 02:31 we might need a different formula entirely 02:31 ais523: what I wanted to do was to create a save backup every n moves 02:31 the issue is, neutral turnstate doesn't neccessarily happen on an even turncount 02:31 LarienTelrunya: it doesn't, it puts up a dialog box that gives you the choice of rewinding the turn or playing on (or leaving the save file for manual inspection) 02:31 and what if you are fast 02:31 basically you'd need to track the movecount of the last save checkpoint 02:31 you could do it on turn boundary, I guess? 02:32 FIQ: well, if 3.4.3 during the dark ages was considered maintained, I'd say, un still is :) 02:32 ok I guess that solves the "being fast" issue 02:32 ais523: ah, I see, but the wording of the message is weird, it should IMHO not say "the save game is corrupted" because it really isn't ;) 02:32 but not the other one 02:32 FIQ: just low maintenance at the moment 02:32 of non-even turn ends 02:32 LarienTelrunya: something that shouldn't have happened did 02:32 currently it's very hard in nh4-based variants to tell if an error is just an impossible() or an actual panic() 02:33 we have no way to know if the file is correct or not 02:33 LarienTelrunya: it is very easy 02:33 if you know to recognize it 02:33 impossible allows you to dismiss the error with P 02:33 and the difference between impossible and panic is intentionally blurry in NH4, the only difference is that impossible gives a "repair" option in addition to "recover", panic doesn't 02:33 panic or desyncs does not 02:33 FIQ: not nearly as easy as in vanilla, where hte error messages are different! 02:33 a user shouldn't need to care about the difference between impossible and panic 02:33 ais523: intentionally??? WHAT 02:33 both indicate something's badly wrong, both are usually best fixed by continuing from a backup 02:34 well sorry, but the user designs a nethack variant herself, so she *does* care about it 02:34 ais523: not neccessarily badly wrong 02:34 in the case of an impossible, you can also attempt to play on if rewinding doesn't help (rather than needing a dev to fix the bug) 02:34 but that's the only real difference 02:34 impossibles can be for clearly error'd cases, but not *critically* badly so 02:34 impossible means that something has gone wrong but not so wrong as to render the game unplayable :P 02:35 that is why you can press P... 02:35 LarienTelrunya: the difference between impossible and panic in practice is whether there's a way to recover, not how bad the problem is 02:35 some problems can be really major and yet have an obvious way to recover them 02:35 that is why in nh3 impossible just prints a message and lets you continue :D 02:35 nh3 impossibles are horribly worded 02:35 it implies you should quit your game 02:35 no, NH3 does that because the alternative is deleting the save 02:35 FIQ: yeah, that message really is stupid 02:36 even then, the file may or may not be playable 02:36 sometimes data's corrupted that's needed for the game to function 02:37 ais523: is it theoretically possible to impossible-scum, by deliberately triggering an impossible (if the player finds a way of doing so) to cancel negative outcomes like e.g. a +3 wish only giving a +0 item? because that would be very bad for game balance 02:38 in NH3 only, panic scums allows this 02:38 not impossibles 02:38 NH4 doesn't allow either 02:38 due to how its save system works 02:38 LarienTelrunya: it'd only rewind to the start of the previous command 02:38 that'd be very hard to do with something like wishing 02:38 and get a benefit from it 02:38 ah 02:38 as you'd need the impossible to happen on the monster turn after the wish 02:39 and somehow not happen if you get the good outcome 02:39 well nh3 allows segfault scumming due to the way checkpointing works :( 02:39 you might be able to fix something up with some ice and a hole trap and a red dragon and a broken migrating timer 02:39 but if you can pull that off, you deserve your +3 :-P 02:40 ais523: dnethack has had 100% reproducible panics/segfaults 02:40 at least one user abused it into oblivion 02:40 heh, with your TAS tools you can apparently pull off a T:1 (or similar) ascension by destroying a wielded cream pie? is it really possible to manipulate the memory corruption to do exactly what you want? 02:40 LarienTelrunya: there are limits but they aren't very constraining 02:40 FIQ: so has vanilla 02:40 acid? 02:41 d4294967296$d4294967296$ will consistently crash 3.4.3 if a) you have any gold in inventory and b) you're not standing on gold 02:41 wow 02:41 nice 02:41 I thought that was fairly well known at this point 02:41 (bonus marks if you can figure out why without trying it) 02:41 well 02:42 I started playing nethack in late 2014 02:43 LarienTelrunya: considering you are on a slash'em base and not nao, you should try it :P 02:43 in slex 02:44 FIQ: somehow doesn't work for me, neither in slex nor in nh343 on hdf 02:44 was nh343 patched here? 02:44 it obviously doesn't work in nh343 on hdf 02:44 since it is nao 02:45 well shit, locally it does crash slex 02:45 it was patched on NAO, yes 02:45 gg 02:45 ais523: do you happen to have the commit that fixes it? 02:45 7c860335c16bfb8382eab4b75ebd01dbd1a69120 02:46 ugh, vanilla nethack devteam commits are always so complicated 02:48 ais523: did I ever mention to you some clarification about that ff/ff+/ff-/travel/whatever comment btw? 02:48 but yeah, gotta fix that for slex, since if word spreads then players might start to abuse it 02:48 this one 02:48 /* 0: h (etc), 1: H (etc), 2: fh (etc) */ 02:48 /* 3: FH, 4: ff+, 5: ff-, 6: FF+, 7: FF- */ 02:48 /* 8: travel */ 02:48 FIQ: no, I don't think you did? I know the comment, of course 02:49 and have some ideas about it myself 02:49 ais523: thanks for telling me about that bug :) 02:49 ais523: they were related to the other game that was (likely) published as part of hack 02:49 huh, that's not what I expected at all 02:49 what other game? 02:50 as you may or may not know, ancient hack files were named hack.c, hack.apply.c, etc 02:51 alongside an ifdef for HACK 02:51 there seems to have been another game by the save developers, possibly distributed alongside Hack 02:51 at first 02:51 and they reuse some code 02:51 4 of the above travel commands (iirc 4-7) was never used in hack itself 02:51 and concerned this other thing 02:52 the other 4 concern variations of go/run/run while turning on corridor edges/travel 02:52 er, travel didn't exist back then 02:52 but yeah 02:58 [4k] Philip (Crawldragon) (Arc Hum Mal Law), 2487 points, T:1034, killed by a giant rat 02:58 that bug exists in grunthack also 02:58 ais523: oh yeah 02:59 Quest 02:59 was the other thing 02:59 and sporkhack 03:00 ais523: this place has info about the other game https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Talk:NetHack_1.3d 03:00 K2: pushed a fix for slex :) 03:00 and dnethack 03:00 LarienTelrunya ok 03:01 can probably copy that for the other nh3-based variants that have the error 03:01 K2: huh? dnethack having that bug surprises me 03:01 since it's based off NAO 03:01 not the most up to date NAO, but NAO regardless 03:02 dnethack on hdf does not seem to have the bug 03:03 but grunthack doesn't either 03:03 nor slex 03:03 so yeah 03:04 maybe it's 64-bit and MAXINT is higher? 03:04 probably simply doesn't reproduce with 32bit there 03:04 try the 64bit maxint 03:04 18446744073709551616? 03:05 "You decide not to part with your hard-earned cash." 03:05 maxint effects are different between 64-bit and 32-bit 03:06 often, a maxint effect in 32-bit won't have anything analogous in 64-bit 03:06 because sometimes a value is stored in an int in some places and a long in other places 03:07 Slash'EM Extended updated 03:07 thanks! 03:08 hmm, the weird thing is, if I try to drop 64-bit MAXINT gold pieces in spork, nothing happens at all; it's as if the game doesn't even acknowledge I tried to drop anything 03:08 you are supposed to do it twice 03:08 for the crash 03:08 and if I try to drop a little less than that amount I get the standard LRS message 03:09 yeah but when I got the crash locally, the first attempt said "You drop 0 gold pieces." 03:09 ah 03:12 what, it crashes because it averages out the ages??? what are they set to anyway? does the MAXINT thing cause the amount value to spill over into the age field and set it to zero? 03:19 [gh] k2 (Mon Elf Mal Neu), 118 points, T:447, killed by Mr. Annootok, the shopkeeper's magic missile 03:22 -!- Crawldragon360 has joined #hardfought 03:23 -!- Crawldragon has quit [Disconnected by services] 03:23 -!- Crawldragon360 is now known as Crawldragon 03:23 -!- elenmirie has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:23 -!- elenmirie_ has joined #hardfought 03:24 -!- elenmirie_ is now known as elenmirie 03:24 LarienTelrunya: turn the gold was generated 03:25 it doesn't do anything but the game averages out timestamps for everything 03:25 and it's a weighted average based on the stack sizes 03:25 if you have 0 gold generated on turn 10, and 0 gold generated on turn 10, what's the average generation turn of a gold piece? 03:26 ohh it uses the stack size too, I see 03:28 -!- Crawldragon has quit [Quit: If beer is liquid bread, what is liquid peanut butter?] 03:34 -!- captain42 has joined #hardfought 03:36 -!- noty has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.9] 03:55 -!- K2 has quit [Quit: Rico, smoke! *poof*] 03:57 -!- mode/Beholder_ [+Zi] by Beholder_ 03:57 -!- card.freenode.net changed the topic on #hardfought to: Welcome to Hardfought - https://www.hardfought.org/ - public irc logs available on website ¤ Public NetHack server - ssh nethack@hardfought.org ¤ GruntHack 0.2.2 and Slash'EM Extended 2.0.5 are now live - NetHack 3.6.1-dev has been updated 03:57 -!- K2 has joined #hardfought 03:57 -!- mode/#hardfought [+o K2] by ChanServ 04:00 -!- Beholder has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:00 -!- mode/#hardfought [+v Beholder] by ChanServ 04:24 Evil Patch idea: hypercharge trap. Causes monsters to randomly not act on a given turn, "storing" their movement energy (maybe with a 50% chance?). Once the RNG decides that they do act, they will get extra actions depending on how many times they did not act. 05:05 it wouldn't be that noticeable at 50% 05:05 maybe you'd get double-hit sometimes 05:06 but it's much less evil than the Crypt of the Necrodancer equivalent 05:08 ais523: 02c05ed and 6acd9c0 might interest you 05:08 it makes dipping consistent to quaffing in that they require , rather than NH3-style "dip into the fountain/water?" 05:08 oh, that's worth memorizing 05:08 I need some notes on this somewhere 05:08 are you still using the fiq4 repo? 05:09 This was pushed to fiqhack 05:10 what is safe_qbuf? 05:10 don't think I've ever seen it until now, somehow 05:11 apparently it's almost unused 05:11 it's a vanilla thing to avoid overflowing buffers in pline(0 05:11 *pline() 05:11 is it still useful 05:12 or the qbuf equivalent 05:12 I'm not 100% sure it's not useless right now 05:12 it rather depends on how the client implements prompts, which I can't remember 05:12 I was trying to get rid of that code, though 05:12 well I am now wondering on whether I have made cases where safe_qbuf is potentially relevant 05:12 which is likely, if it actually does something 05:15 I think the vanilla devs missed some even in 3.4.3 05:15 which is a good reason to remove it! 05:15 H - a blessed greased +6 elven leather helm of carrying (being worn) 05:15 Wut? of carrying? 05:15 ais523: in vanilla if you lack infravision, mitre will allow you to see monsters in the dark within its radius 05:15 this is not the case in NH4 05:16 it was more exarbated in fiqhack when I buffed xray to a range of 8, but the bug should still be there in nethack4 vanilla 05:16 Mandevil: +10% carrycap 05:16 Stacks with other items of carrying 05:16 FIQ: that doesn't surprise me, I probably broke something in the extrinsic rewrite 05:16 How do you get oilsking bag of holding? 05:16 I wasn't even aware that was a mechanic 05:16 Mandevil: By being lucky 05:16 Or dip it into wonder 05:17 How to get wonder? Good luck without wishes 05:17 Haha. 05:17 It's arguably rarer than wands of wishing 05:17 I knew it's nothing for me. 05:17 Maybe make it more common? 05:17 Since it rarely would be as game changing as wow. 05:17 The effect of the potion is rather powerful 05:18 It gives an object property... 05:18 ...and a random one. 05:18 You can get exotic intrinsics with it, or can dip objects *of your choice* into it to make it attain an object property 05:18 That's way weaker than a WoW. 05:18 Oh I'm not arguing it being stronger than WoW 05:18 Far from it 05:18 I just don't want to make it common 05:18 It is 3/1000 of all pots at the moment 05:18 Alright. 05:18 But rarer than WoW is that most of the game you won't get one. 05:19 That's like it isn't there at all. 05:19 Possibly 05:19 But it's wishable 05:19 Sounds like terrible wish. 05:19 Mandevil: Maybe I made it a bit *too* rare? 05:19 FIQ: That's what I am saying. 05:19 Maybe it should be on par with the other "rarest" potions atm 05:19 FIQ: Alternatively, make one or two guaranteed somewhere? 05:20 full healing, polymorph and acid 05:20 are all 10/1000 in vanilla (9/1000 in fiqhack since that's where I took the wonder odds from) 05:20 Mandevil: the obvious place for that is GKWC 05:21 FIQ: GKWC? 05:21 Oh! 05:21 The cellar Mine's End. 05:22 Also, mark the use of the potion in the game log. 05:22 I changed the odds for it to spawn 05:22 to 10/1000 05:22 Nice. 05:22 nerfed some of the 42/1000 ones to 40 05:22 also changed the 9/1000 ones back to 10/1000 05:24 FIQ: !oFH is more common in vanilla due to monster starting inventory 05:24 ais523: Of course 05:24 Likewise with acid 05:25 Evil Patch idea: monsters that have potions and are standing next to you can decide to dip a random item in your inventory into the potion. 05:25 ooh suppose it's polymorph 05:26 yeah :D "Your gray dragon scale mail turns into a leather armor!" 05:26 "Generation: 10/1000 of all potions. Some of the 42/1000 potions was changed to 40/1000 to compensate (confusion, gain ability, booze, sickness, fruit juice)" 05:30 Mandevil: I think the most powerful use of wonder atm is to dip jewelry into it 05:30 FIQ: can it backfire (giving a negative extrinsic)? I assume it's unlikely to because most extrinsics are positive 05:30 When you dip BoH into it, is it guaranteed to get oilskin? 05:30 Mandevil: Since oilskin is the only possible property, yes 05:31 How about bag of holding of carrying :) 05:31 ais523: Yes, both for objects (bad object properties like hunger or fumbling) or yourself (have fun being permanently slow) 05:31 FIQ: bag of holding of digestion, randomly deletes objects when opened :P 05:31 LarienTelrunya: I considered adding a "greed" property 05:31 LarienTelrunya: that's just being cursed 05:31 which would make the bag refuse to be opened 80% of the time 05:31 wasting the turn 05:32 FIQ: ah, that would probably make more sense gameplay-wise 05:32 ais523: yeah but it would happen even while it's not cursed :) I guess the properties are removed by cancelling an item, though 05:32 to balance out the fact that atm there's only one property for containers 05:32 and it is a good one 05:33 Mandevil: You can actually get oilskin blindfolds/etc this way since oilskin is *allowed* on anything made of cloth, it just doesn't generate 05:33 is the granted property automatically identified? 05:33 ais523: No 05:33 You don't get knowledge of weapon enchantment just because you read enchant weapon 05:33 Similar logic 05:34 ais523: Also, trying to add properties on an item that already has one can backfire 05:34 "magic" propety for BoH. 05:34 how does that work technically? a pknown flag? 05:34 Makes it linked to all magic BoHs in the game :) 05:35 To balance out excess potions 05:35 ais523: oprops_known int 05:35 if it doesn't match oprops, you see "magical" as a prefix 05:35 meaning it has unknown properties 05:35 oh, so it can have multiple properties that are IDed separaely 05:35 yes 05:35 exactly 05:35 and the "magical" will remain until you have identified all of them 05:36 magical silver long sword of draining and fire 05:36 (it is also vorpal, but you have no idea!0 05:36 No object material randomness in fiqhack atm, sorry 05:36 ) 05:36 Allthough I have considered it 05:37 Mandevil: that's an interesting way of implementing magic chests 05:37 having a container property for it 05:38 I can see one problem with it. 05:38 being? 05:38 What happens when you remove the property? 05:39 I don't see the problem with that 05:39 the weird thing is *adding* the property to it 05:39 Imagine you have three magic chests. 05:39 mhm 05:39 And you remove the property from one. 05:39 What will be its contents? 05:39 Will it disappear? 05:39 well, it will be empty 05:39 But why? 05:39 What if it is the last magic chest in the game? 05:39 Will it still disappear? 05:40 then you lose access to the content 05:40 until you either make a new one, or find a new one 05:40 So magic chest is just access portal to some off-plane storage? 05:40 yes 05:40 as I said 05:40 the weird part isn't removing the property 05:40 but adding it 05:40 what happens to the existing content 05:40 Then yes. 05:41