00:23 <aosdict> !tell NeroOneTrueKing putting your shield formula in the proposal, it's certainly better than having enchantment not matter
00:23 <Beholder> Will do, aosdict!
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06:33 <Beholder> [dnh] k2 (Wiz Hum Mal Neu), 2515 points, T:2073, killed by a little dog
06:46 <Tangles> 'evening K2
06:50 <K2> hiya!
06:51 <K2> hows things?
06:51 <Tangles> not too bad.
06:51 <Tangles> How goes dnethack?
06:52 <Tangles> looks like you didn't quite get that one started.
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06:55 <K2> yeah...
06:56 <K2> i've played a couple games since the big splat
06:56 <K2> nothing to exciting yet
06:56 <Tangles> Ah well :/
06:57 <K2> heh
06:57 <K2> how's the unnethack game coming?
06:57 <Tangles> I'm just thinking about how to proceed.
06:57 <Tangles> I have a couple of ascension kit options.
06:57 <K2> what point are you at?
06:58 <Tangles> I've done everything I can before waking Rodney, except for adjusting gear and getting ready.
06:59 <K2> ooh thats far
06:59 <K2> convict right?
06:59 <Tangles> Currently I've got SDSM, amulet of flying, and dual-wielding crysknives.
06:59 <Tangles> yeah
06:59 <K2> sweet
06:59 <Tangles> but my only MR is from the quest artifact.
07:00 <K2> hrm
07:00 <Tangles> I have some gray scales I could enchant, but then I'd have to swap out the amulet of flying for reflection.
07:01 <K2> ring of levitation?
07:01 <Tangles> I'm trying to remember what happens on the run in UnNetHack. Can you still teleport?
07:01 <K2> or i suppose flying is pretty cool
07:01 <K2> no i dont think so
07:01 <K2> force is gone
07:01 <K2> so no tele
07:02 <K2> and nasties will spawn around you as you get close to stairs
07:02 <Tangles> Hmm. so then I won't need teleport control (which is currently taking up a ring slot)
07:02 <Tangles> which means I could keep a ring of lev handy.
07:03 <K2> and remember you cant find the portal using the usual confused gold dection scroll method
07:03 <K2> detection
07:03 <Tangles> this also begs the question.... what am I going to do with these 75 tele scrolls.
07:03 <K2> poly? :P
07:03 <Tangles> Yeah I guess.
07:04 <K2> donate them to charity
07:04 <Tangles> I just had a massive polypile-fest trying to get a CoMR.
07:04 <Tangles> and a tooled horn (got a drum so that will do)
07:05 <Tangles> but yeah I can't remember how I detected the portal last time.
07:05 <Tangles> Don't think I've got a crystal ball.
07:05 <Tangles> and weight is a BIG problem.
07:07 <K2> you could use cursed scrolls of gold detection
07:07 <Tangles> I think cursed GD should still work. Just not on water or fire.
07:07 <Tangles> lol jinx
07:07 <K2> but on plane of earth and fire its a problem
07:07 <K2> hah
07:07 <K2> so the AoY will get warm and show the portal when you get close
07:07 <K2> even if you arent wearing it
07:07 <Tangles> I noticed that in spork
07:08 <Tangles> does that work in Un too?
07:08 <K2> i think my last 2 un asc I relied on that plus wands of secret door detection
07:08 <K2> I think so, lemme check
07:08 <K2> so many variants
07:08 <Tangles> Oh yeah SDD of course.
07:08 <K2> i get confused which does what
07:08 <Tangles> I have plenty of those.
07:08 <Tangles> I think I'm set.
07:09 <Tangles> Just need to decide what to do about MR.
07:10 <Tangles> do the sanctum priests sometimes generate with CoMR or is that Protection I'm thinking of?
07:10 <Tangles> Because I'm tempted to ditch the silver scales and go with chromatic, but that doesn't solve the problem.
07:11 <K2> i dont think so
07:11 <K2> generally just robes
07:11 <K2> are you out of wishes? prob so this being unnethack
07:12 <Tangles> no
07:12 <K2> aaaahhh
07:12 <Tangles> I'm wishless.
07:12 <K2> ok
07:12 <K2> you have wands of death?
07:13 <Tangles> yeah
07:13 <Tangles> 3 I think
07:13 <K2> cthulhu is a pain ;)
07:13 <Tangles> 0:6, 0:4 and 1:5. Should be enough.
07:13 <K2> nice
07:14 <Tangles> The RNG has been kind with markers too, so I can charge.
07:14 <K2> yeah you got this
07:16 <Tangles> ok I think I'll enchant the gray scales now, and switch to the chromatic if I find a CoMR in the sanctum.
07:20 <K2> \o/
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08:06 <raisse> yay my unknown uncursed amulet is reflection
08:06 <Beholder> [dnh] k2 (Wiz Hum Mal Neu) entered Minetown for the first time, on T:2194
08:07 <raisse> I just bumped into a floating eye (hard to see because of the glare where I'm sitting)
08:07 <K2> nice
08:07 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Orc Fem Cha) had Magicbane bestowed upon her by Anhur, on T:7205
08:13 <Beholder> [un] Tangles (Con Orc Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:59356
08:14 <Tangles> Ok... it's on :)
08:15 <raisse> who has a cat called Alfie and died in minetown?
08:16 <raisse> ah, it's elenmirie, I've also found a cat called Coco (but can't tame it, have only lichen corpses)
08:16 <raisse> I threw a little dog corpse at Alfie
08:18 <raisse> ah yes, there's elenmirie's ghost
08:18 <raisse> also the bones pile and the probable cause of death (a plains centaur)
08:18 <elenmirie> yes, Alfie is another cat name of mine
08:19 <raisse> no, You read: "elenmirie, poisoned by a rotted quivering blob corpse".
08:19 <elenmirie> ah, that one
08:19 <elenmirie> :(
08:19 <K2> go Tangles!
08:19 <raisse> TWO wands of cancellation! and I've already got one!
08:20 <raisse> ooh, your BoH is uncursed
08:20 <raisse> makes it a lot easier
08:22 <K2> woot BoH in minetown shop
08:23 <aosdict> Is today BoH day?
08:24 <K2> hmm
08:24 <K2> august 28th is... have you hugged your bag of holding today? day
08:28 <raisse> I've blessed mine, does that count?
08:28 <K2> yes
08:29 <raisse> I'm afraid Alfie killed Coco while I wasn't looking
08:37 <rumflump> heya k2
08:37 <K2> hi
08:37 <Beholder> Hello K2, Welcome to #hardfought
08:38 <rumflump> been hangin in an egalitarian community
08:38 <rumflump> practically a month off from computers, though they are around
08:39 <K2> the horror
08:39 <rumflump> did nethack 5 happen yet?
08:39 <K2> we're on 7
08:39 <rumflump> hot
08:40 <hothraxxa> i like that you can wear a bag on your head now to blind yourself
08:40 <Beholder> [un] Tangles (Con Orc Mal Cha) killed Cthulhu, on T:59570
08:41 <rumflump> athames are probably digging tools
08:41 <rumflump> and i bet wizards get an extra wrest from each wand
08:41 <aosdict> yanis are a thing of the past. the devteam's telepathic network with all of us ensures that any idea gets implemented immediately
08:42 <Tangles> You have a little trouble removing G - 10 cursed potions of gain level.
08:42 <rumflump> go tangles.
08:42 <Tangles> aka GTFO-juice
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08:42 <raisse> don't step on any fire traps and boil the other 9
08:43 <K2> Tangles is riding the express train out of hell
08:45 <aosdict> Go Tangles!
08:47 <raisse> Alfie eats a lizard corpse.
08:48 <raisse> That was MY lizard corpse, Alfie!
08:48 <jonadab> Uh-oh.  When your pet eats the only lizard corpse, that's a sure sign cockatrices are imminent.
08:49 <raisse> yes, that's what I thought
08:49 <aosdict> yasi: pets you get from other players' bones files, like pokemon you get from other trainers, are harder to get to do what you want.
08:51 <raisse> jonadab: or at least chickies
08:51 <jonadab> Or, you know, soldiers wielding corpses.
08:52 <raisse> I don't really expect those on dlvl 5
08:52 <raisse> I'm xp7
08:52 <raisse> I'm quite pleased with Alfie, trying to kill a coaligned unicorn now
08:54 <raisse> You sense that a tripe ration has appeared where Alfie was!
08:54 <raisse> silly cat eating mimics in the store
09:11 <Tangles> You have a little trouble lifting a rustproof long sword named Sunsword.
09:11 <Tangles> So the collection of useless long-sword artifacts continues, even now.
09:11 <Tangles> An archon spawned with it.
09:13 <jonadab> Useless?  But the wiki says Sunsword is "rather useful"!
09:14 <jonadab> Or, hmm.  Actually, I think it doesn't say that any more.
09:14 <jonadab> Someone must have changed it.
09:14 <Beholder> [un] Tangles (Con Orc Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:60098
09:16 <Tangles> jonadab: All long swords are useless to me this game.
09:16 <Tangles> I'm just commenting on the irony of having such a wide choice of long sword artifacts when I can't use them.
09:17 <jonadab> Yes.
09:17 <jonadab> But Sunsword being "rather useful" was a long-standing joke.
09:17 <Tangles> ah ok
09:17 <jonadab> But that seems to have been edited out of the wiki now.
09:17 <jonadab> Probably because it's nonsense.
09:17 <Tangles> Oh right... "The wiki says"... I didn't read that properly.
09:18 <Beholder> [nd] Raisse (Wiz Orc Fem Cha), 9520 points, T:14240, killed by a warg
09:18 <raisse> grr.
09:18 <raisse> fortunately it's on the oracle level and not on the level below, may have left bones
09:18 <raisse> without all those wands of cancellation though
09:18 <raisse> you'll have to bring your own
09:19 <raisse> ah well, back to the word mines
09:19 <Tangles> Also, aren't there only supposed to be 9 nazguls?
09:19 <Tangles> Maybe it's 9 per level or something...
09:20 <Tangles> I'm getting tired of being stunned by their "horrific screams"
09:21 <Mandevil> Yes, there should only be nine.
09:28 <aosdict> jonadab: then let's buff late game undead so it will be rather useful! :)
09:29 <aosdict> it's certainly rather useful in grunthack
09:31 <jonadab> aosdict: more liches?  Non-genocideable arch-liches like FIQ wants to do?
09:31 <jonadab> Tangles: Yes, there should only be 9 nazgul.
09:33 <aosdict> well, the stuff like spectres, resurrecting zombies, minotaur zombies, skeletal dragons, vampire mages...
09:33 <Mandevil> jonadab: Nazgûl... FTFY.
09:34 <aosdict> we have talked about this before
09:35 <jonadab> aosdict: Oh, right, all that stuff, yeah.
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10:16 <aosdict> yani: elven priests start with an elven shield instead of a small shield
10:24 <Beholder> [un] Tangles (Con Orc Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:61014
10:33 <Beholder> [un] Tangles (Con Orc Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:61185
10:37 <Tangles> so there's multiple traps on the planes of earth and air as well, which limits the usefulness of cursed scrolls of gold detection.
10:39 <Beholder> [un] Tangles (Con Orc Mal Cha) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:61280
10:40 <Mandevil> Gold detection works in Un?????
10:41 <Mandevil> I thought it doesn't.
10:42 <aosdict> I think *confused* gold detection doesn't work.
10:42 <aosdict> Cursed will still show a bunch of $ though.
10:42 <Mandevil> I wish I knew this earlier.
10:47 <Tangles> Mandevil: There's extra falling rock traps on Earth and sleeping gas traps on Air that make it nearly useless.
10:47 <Mandevil> I see.
10:47 <Tangles> Particularly on Air. You have to blind yourself or the $ disappear as soon as you can see the space.
10:47 <Mandevil> I usually just wear/wield the amulet.
10:48 <Mandevil> Oh, so many scrolls of genocide.
10:50 <aosdict> Tangles: I did it by copying the map and just using it as a guide for which spaces had had a $
10:53 <Mandevil> Those worms didn't last long.
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10:57 <K2> i'm humming the song 'purple rain' in my head
10:59 <Beholder> [un] Tangles (Con Orc Mal Cha) killed Famine, on T:61609
11:01 <Beholder> [un] Tangles (Con Orc Mal Cha) killed the invisible Pestilence, on T:61638
11:02 <aosdict> that's a lot of purple rain
11:04 <aosdict> you can write while blind?
11:05 <aosdict> oh, well done
11:06 <K2> Tangles: name all of the worms after the snow white dwarves
11:06 <K2> or santa's reindeer
11:06 <aosdict> all of them? I think there is a shortage of dwarf names
11:07 <aosdict> yani: a scroll of genocide will only work once on a given level
11:08 <aosdict> reading further scrolls on that level does nothing
11:09 <Tangles> yay!
11:10 <aosdict> excellent sword collection you have there
11:10 <Tangles> I know, right!
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11:10 <Tangles> Giantslayer is actually a sling.
11:10 <Tangles> and finding it early was probably what enabled me to survive at the start.
11:11 <K2> woooo!'
11:11 <K2> congrats Tangles!
11:11 <raisse> congrats Tangles!
11:11 <aosdict> Con-grats. :)
11:11 <K2> thats impressive
11:11 <raisse> oh like Goliath
11:11 <Tangles> so apparently there were only 9 Nazgul...
11:11 <K2> never seen a convict asc before
11:11 <raisse> yes, there are only 9
11:12 <Tangles> It seemed like so many more!
11:12 <raisse> that's what they *are*, "nine for mortal men, doomed to die"
11:12 <aosdict> can't remember if it's supposed to be likely in unnethack to encounter all of them
11:12 <aosdict> in vanilla you certainly have to try to encounter all of them
11:13 <aosdict> I don't think I've ever seen more than 6
11:13 <Beholder> [un] Tangles (Con Orc Mal Cha), 1821397 points, T:61721, ascended
https://www.hardfought.org/userdata/T/Tangles/un531/dumplog/1502459448.un531.txt.html
11:13 <raisse> I think I ascended with 7 rings once and had seen (but been unable to reach) one more
11:14 <Tangles> Thanks everyone :D
11:15 <aosdict> couldn't reach? did he spawn in Rodney's tower while you were on the way up or something?
11:15 <raisse> yes, that
11:15 <raisse> either that or on the other side of an elemental plane when I was already at the portal
11:15 <raisse> air seems plausible
11:17 <Tangles> !scores
11:17 <Beholder> Tangles: https://www.hardfought.org/nethack/scoreboard (HDF) or https://scoreboard.xd.cm (ALL)
11:18 <Tangles> 3rd... not bad :) Was never going to get near oh6's epic tourist.
11:19 <K2> no E word, no wishes, no genocides
11:19 <K2> wow
11:20 <Tangles> Oh hey I just realised I wrote scare monster without formally identifying it. That was a bit lucky.
11:20 <Tangles> Yeah also no polyself (but that was also just luck)
11:21 <Tangles> but I did cheat once in sokoban.
11:32 <K2> heh
11:33 <Tangles> Oh man it's late. I'm just going to finish this cup of tea, then go to bed.
11:34 <Tangles> K2: Now that that's out of the way, tomorrow night I'll have a look at the dungeon overview patch for grunt.
11:35 <Tangles> Then I might have to actually have a serious go at playing it :)
11:35 <K2> awesome ;)
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11:41 <FIQ> aosdict: so that they can't cast? sounds like an amazing idea
11:41 <FIQ> @ elven priests start iwth an elven shield
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11:48 <aosdict> is that any different from starting with a small shield? don't think so
11:48 <K2> elven shields count as large
11:49 <K2> much greater spell failure penalty
11:51 <aosdict> well, priests are kind of supposed to cast utility spells having removed penalizing stuff.
11:59 <NeroOneTrueKing> Do we still need "non-buckler shields give unequaled enormous spellcasting penalties"? Would a sliding scale be better?
11:59 <Beholder> NeroOneTrueKing: Message from aosdict at 2017-08-28 00:23 EDT: putting your shield formula in the proposal, it's certainly better than having enchantment not matter
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12:00 <NeroOneTrueKing> applying that enchantment change to all armor is still YASI-ish :)
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12:48 <Beholder> [nd] munterplant (Val Hum Fem Law) had Excalibur thrown at her by some watery tart, on T:3388
12:49 <Beholder> [nd] munterplant (Val Hum Fem Law) changed form for the first time, becoming a wererat, on T:3675
12:49 <Beholder> [nd] munterplant (Val Hum Fem Law) rejected atheism with a prayer, on T:3676
12:58 <raisse> A cloud of gas puts you to sleep!  You dream that you hear a door open.  You dream that you hear the footsteps of a guard on patrol.
12:58 <raisse> strange dreams from those fumes!
12:58 <APic> :)
13:09 <aosdict> NeroOneTrueKing: well, in this combat system, you can still cast fairly well with a shield if your other hand is free :)
13:10 <aosdict> s/fairly well/sometimes/
13:12 <aosdict> oh, and that formula doesn't apply to all armor. Just shields.
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14:10 <Beholder> [dyn] groovejumper (Arc Hum Fem Neu), 528 points, T:846, killed by a rabid rat
14:17 <Beholder> [fh] Jared (Jared55) (Wiz Hum Mal Neu), 33138 points, T:1586, poisoned by a rotted gnome corpse
14:17 <jared55> y do i forget to pray instead of eating bad food
14:17 <jared55> >.<
14:18 <APic> >.<
14:24 <Beholder> [dyn] groovejumper (Arc Dwa Fem Law), 2090 points, T:2088, killed by a hill orc
14:27 <jared55> whats the difference between high boots and low boots? im guessing one is water walking
14:30 <FIQ> high boots give 1 more AC
14:35 <jonadab> high boots are taller, so they cover more of your ankles.
14:36 <jonadab> I used to think this was relevant for xan attacks, but now I think not.
14:36 <jonadab> They seem to be able to prick right through the boots anyhow.
14:41 <Beholder> [dyn] groovejumper (Arc Hum Fem Neu), 1094 points, T:1150, killed by a kitten
14:41 <jared55> lol do those just make you lame?
14:41 <jared55> i remember getting bit in the ankles or something and nothing happened
14:42 <jonadab> They give you wounded legs, which greatly reduces your carry capacity.
14:42 <jonadab> Temporarily.
14:43 <jonadab> In practice, by the time you run into them, it's not a big deal.
14:43 <jonadab> You can just set down your bag of holding to unburden yourself and wait out the short timeout.
14:43 <jonadab> Which is only a few hundred turns.
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14:54 <jared55> right on
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15:21 <Beholder> [dyn] groovejumper (Arc Dwa Fem Law), 914 points, T:1633, killed by Ms. Kinnegad, the shopkeeper
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16:17 <Beholder> [nd] elenmirie (Mon Hum Fem Neu) entered Gehennom, on T:19906
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17:22 <Beholder> [dnh] Tarmunora (Ana Dro Fem Cha), 14276 points, T:2955, killed by a blast of fire
17:36 <Beholder> [dnh] NeroOneTrueKing (Cav Bat Mal Neu) killed the hateful whispers, on T:47776
17:38 <Beholder> [dnh] NeroOneTrueKing (Cav Bat Mal Neu) killed the Wizard of Yendor, on T:47895
17:45 <Beholder> [dnh] NeroOneTrueKing (Cav Bat Mal Neu) performed the invocation, on T:48298
18:25 <Beholder> [slex] zennaris (Bul Ogr Mal Neu), 23696 points, T:4100, caught himself in his own magical blast
18:59 <oh6> !tell tangles congrats on the convict ascension!
18:59 <Beholder> Will do, oh6!
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19:34 <Tangles> heh
19:34 <Beholder> Tangles: Message from oh6 at 2017-08-28 18:59 EDT: congrats on the convict ascension!
19:34 <Tangles> thanks oh6!
19:41 <Tangles> err...
19:42 <Tangles> !tell oh6 Thanks :)
19:42 <Beholder> Will do, Tangles!
19:42 <oh6> no worries
19:42 <Beholder> oh6: Message from Tangles at 2017-08-28 19:42 EDT: Thanks :)
19:42 <Tangles> lol
19:42 <oh6> I'm currently trying to decide if I should bother riding this mastodon
19:44 <oh6> hm, looks like even with regular speed boots, so I guess nt
19:45 <Tangles> I don't know.... I don't ride much tbh, though I did have a saddled leviathan (orange dragon) for a while in the convict game, which was useful before I had another source of flying.
19:45 <Tangles> but mastodons don't even give you that :/
19:46 <Tangles> Anyway, late for work!
19:47 <Tangles> talk later.
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20:17 <Beholder> [nd] jonathan (Tou Hum Mal Neu), 258 points, T:1588, killed by a magic missile, while jumping around
20:17 <Jonathanhanes> no streak for me
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20:57 <K2> back on day shift wooo! which means going to bed early. gnite all :P
20:58 <Tarmunora> Night
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